So we all have our favorites. Some posters base their whole gimmick/personality on that fact. SM and his love of Kane for instance. But I have a hard time believing that you just saw a guy and were instantly a fan. There had to be a reason that you went #allin. Maybe a match, a promo, segment, whatever. So what was the instance that you were on Team Blank? Pete Dunne I was a fan very early on, but I think the first time he teased a babyface turn to help his fellow UK guys only to just be getting his belt from the ring. After that I was convinced he was awesome where before I was only on the fence.

Brock Lesnar made his debut once I started watching on a regular basis, he had a cool move in the F5 and he was undefeated, enough to impress 11 year old me.

I asked my parents to buy me a Brock Lesnar shirt from WWE shop and of course the day it arrived was Survivor Series 02 where he suffered his first pinfall loss 😭.

I also followed CM Punk very early in his career after reading an article about him (i think Power Slam) and was first time I had heard of Straight Edge. That partly influenced my decision never to drink/do drugs but I don’t really care for Punk that much these days.

Brock and Kurt Angle as i remember them from there amateur days as amateur wrestling is my first love.

Triple H - started watching wrestling full-time around 2000, I wasn't a Rock guy or an Austin guy and saw Hunter, and thought this is my guy. He had evolved from the DX character into The Game, looked like a champion, had the title at the time and was the #1 worker in the world.

Nov 28, 2018 1:20:38 GMT System said:

Brock Lesnar made his debut once I started watching on a regular basis, he had a cool move in the F5 and he was undefeated, enough to impress 11 year old me.

I asked my parents to buy me a Brock Lesnar shirt from WWE shop and of course the day it arrived was Survivor Series 02 where he suffered his first pinfall loss 😭.

I also followed CM Punk very early in his career after reading an article about him (i think Power Slam) and was first time I had heard of Straight Edge. That partly influenced my decision never to drink/do drugs but I don’t really care for Punk that much these days.

Nov 28, 2018 1:41:01 GMT spladle125 said:

Brock and Kurt Angle as i remember them from there amateur days as amateur wrestling is my first love.

Brock is my only case of straight up Day One, no ish about it.

He debuted on the RAW after 'Mania X8 (I think... or maybe it was a week later?) interfering in some meaningless hardcore title match and wrecking shit. I was sold. No idea why in that moment. But I recall thinking, even if this new guy was only going to be a fixture in the hardcore scene, I was #allin on him. Then I learned about his legit amateur credentials, and I fell even deeper into instant love (as I, like spladle125, love amateur wrestling owing to my own days on the mats). And then Brock went on to receive one helluva push in 2002, and he was solidly established for me. So much so that I didn't even care when he walked in 2004. He was a god to me. He could do no wrong, and I was convinced that he'd not only be able to walk on to the Vikings... would not only start... but would carry them to a solid playoff performance.

Then he went to Japan and wrecked shit, and then the UFC run happened. And then he returned to WWE and murdered Cena and ended the Streak.

Some 16 years later and Lesnar is still a god to me. Since #DayOne. Since always. Since forever.

Great topic. I'll cover my Top 10 all time favorite wrestlers.

Ric Flair- His 1989 feud with Funk made him one of my guys after 2 years of indifference. He leveled up when he came to WWF as "The Real World Champion." If he wasn't already my favorite wrestler, he definitely was after winning Royal Rumble '92. By this point he's probably already my favorite wrestler of all time, but I never really thought in terms of 'all time favorite' until late 95-early 96 when a resurgent Flair in real time WCW happened to perfectly coincide with my big NWA tape binge. From that moment on he has been my undisputed all time favorite wrestler.

Owen Hart- Survivor Series '93 and the aftermath put him on my radar for the first time after years of being the WWF wrestler I was most likely to forget existed. From there it was a slow progression to the top. Turning on Bret at Royal Rumble '94 boosted him into my real time Top 5-10. Beating Bret at WM 10 made me think he could be a Guy Who Mattered long term rather than just a quirky flash in the pan personal favorite. Winning KOTR '94 put him into all time favorite status. He has remained there ever since.

Mick Foley- First became a fan of his during the Vader feud in 1993 but he was back to being just another 6/10 guy for about his first 16 months as Mankind. Then came the sitdown interviews with JR. That's when I began to love Mick Foley (again). He has been an all time favorite ever since.

Undertaker- Day One! Survivor Series 1990. Immediately thought he was awesome and have rarely wavered on him since.

Jerry Lawler- I dug his commentary from Day One. I can't really explain why, but he immediately became "my guy" on commentary, instantly replacing previous favorites like Heenan & Ventura. As a wrestler, it would have to be attacking Bret at KOTR '93. BUT I still kind of thought he was a(n awesome) joke a la Honkytonk Man until I got into the Apter Mags in 95-96. Watching him kick ass in 80s Memphis in tape form circa 2000 solidified his all time Top 10 status. 

Kurt Angle- 3rd or 4th vignette (so Day 3 or 4) once I saw where they were going with his character. "Heel who thinks he's a face" had been a personal favorite gimmick of mind going back to the Rougeaux & HTM, and Angle may have been even better than those guys. It would be like 7 years before he finally ceased to be a Top 3 contemporary favorite. That has to be the longest stretch of any wrestler ever given my fickleness.

JBL- Another slow progression. His longevity push at Royal Rumble '98 followed by (oddly enough) his feud with Jim Cornette's awful NWA stable put him on my radar after 2 years of thinking he was a dated, boring wrestler who was likely to be let go any day. He leveled up when he formed the Acolytes with Faarooq and started destroying dudes on the B & C shows. Leveled up again into my then-current Top 10 with the awesome backstage APA skits in late 99-early 2000. I was down with JBL from Day One and the longer he held the title, the higher he climbed on my list of all time favorites.

Jacques Rougeau- When he turned heel, joined up with Jimmy Hart, and became an All American Boy. I was down with both The Mountie & Quebecers from Day One. Those two runs solidified Jacques' all timer status.

Mr. Perfect- Hmm....I'm actually not sure about this one. I know I was fairly indifferent to his early WWF run as plain ol' Curt Hennig. So probably when he joined forced with The Genius, whenever that was....or maybe when he got that epic theme....or started feuding with Hogan. I dunno. Whichever one of those perfect things came first. My memory isn't so hot for Mr. P.

Terry Funk- When he feuded with Flair in 1989. So Day One(ish) depending on whether I saw WM 2 before his 1989 NWA run, which is entirely possible.

Hulk Hogan: Day One! I was born in the 80s, Hogan was professional wrestling, and I don't remember a time where he didn't exist as such. I started to turn on him early during his WCW run, but the nWo revived my love for the GOAT. Single handedly started two wrestling booms, one as a babyface, one as a heel, will never be done again. We'll be lucky to get ONE wrestling boom again, as we're approaching 20 years past the last one.

Ric Flair: Not day one. I rented a WCW tape just before his WWF run was about to begin (coincidentally), and I just saw this flabby old man. His wrestling prowess wouldn't have really impressed me yet, and I didn't get the Ric Flair thing until Royal Rumble 1992.

Bret Hart: I couldn't say. I was a big Hart Foundation fan, but I'm just old enough to remember them as heels (via Coliseum Videos which were always six months behind), and I probably didn't like them. I liked Hitman pretty early on, his initial singles run was extremely (as they say now) my shit. I got a (sweaty post-match) high five from him at a house show in 1992 cementing his status as Kilgore Hall of Famer. He's been my favorite wrestler (specifically in an in ring sort of way) since before then, and to this very day. Loved his heel run. Loved his retirement fuck the world tour for the last 18 years.

Brian fucking Pillman: Day one. When I was really young, he was Flyin' Brian, which appealed to my young babyface loving fandom. He had the Bengals tights, and he had the best aerial attack I had ever seen up to that point (it looks average with today's eyes, but you have to understand most of us had never seen somebody do a springboard before, so this was crazy shit), a recipe for child wonderment. By the time I was getting old enough to sort of intellectualize wrestling, Brian Pillman was ahead of every wrestler in the game. He then appealed to me in that way until his untimely death.

Steve Austin: Not a day one. In fact, not even a year one. I didn't really start buying Steve Austin stock until the Dangerous Alliance in 1992. By the Hollywood Blonds run in 1993 I would bought every Austin stock there was. But not day one. 

Sabu: Day one. Sabu is the most day one wrestler who ever lived. Seeing him for the first time in 1995 (or those that were lucky enough to see him before that) is the most mindblowing experience there was, ever will be. Not only was it a unique aerial attack, but it was hardcore many years before it became a cliche. He was a revolutionary at two aspects of wrestling at the very same time. Sabu is a wrestling god. 

Unfortunately most of the wrestlers I were into were already 'the' man when I became a fan of theirs. So even though I considered myself a Goldberg fan first and a Pro Wrestling fan second from day one, in reality Goldberg already had a World Championship run under his belt and was just starting to appear in movies. Same goes for guys like Mankind, Rob Van Dam, Billy Kidman etc.

I really didn't start digging further until 2011 or so, since then a few guys who jumped out at me:

Tetsuya Naito - In 2009, Naito and Takahashi toured TNA as No Limit. Now at the time I wasn't going out and buying Tetsuya Naito merchandise, but that No Limit tag team stuck with me and it blew my mind when I realised that one of the guys who worked a couple of fun TV matches went onto main event the Tokyo Dome.

TJ Perkins - TJP has been around for a fairly long time, but he still wasn't a name when I caught him in ROH circa 2011. What stood out about TJP was his attention to detail. Here was a guy who could take all sorts of bumps, but he knew how to lay everything out so every near-fall made sense and the match had a logical progression. In a year where Davey Richards was working 'epics', his match with Perkins always stood out to me.

Michael Elgin - Big Mike was another stand-out from those 2011 ROH shows. What I liked about Elgin was that he came across as a genuine athlete capable of all these feats that would be easy to market and promote. A lot of what he was capable of in the ring was genuinely impressive and it just seemed like he was one big feud off from main eventing. I'm really not sure what happened with Mike, there's all these rumours doing the rounds, but he just never seemed able to bring out of that mid-card level.

Adam Cole - One of the few guys I was there from close to the beginning, Cole was just beginning to break out as a member of Future Shock, but it seemed like he was going to be the Jannetty. However, before he started stealing Jericho's shtick, Cole was one of those guys who excelled at the fundamentals and was surprisingly good on the microphone. He was still pretty green at the time so while he and Kyle were having killer matches with the Wolves and Bucks it seemed like he'd be a ways off, he went and had this match with O'Reilly where he started bleeding from the mouth and played up to it that made me believe he'd be a star.

Dalton Castle - Caught him when he rocked up in CHIKARA as Ashley Remmington and thought he was insanely good for a curtain jerker. His mannerisms playing a ship captain was out of this world and while he didn't display anything incredible in the ring, I thought he showed tremendous restraint which is rare on the independents. When he initially rocked up in ROH I didn't recognise him, but I was instantly drawn in by the character and thought ROH were onto something. It's funny because ROH had Donovan Dijack who is pretty much the prototypical wrestler, but I was all for Dalton, while Bake was all for Beer City Bruiser.

Lio Rush - Honestly good for him becoming a manager and becoming a bigger star than he was ever going to be as a Cruiserweight, but I'm still bummed he's going to be perceived as a manger from this moment forward. At the time, it seemed like every high flying cruiserweight was doing dives for the sake of dives, so when Rush actually started displaying personality in the ring, I became a fan. He was one of the few guys in ROH who wasn't afraid to experiment with the formula and would actually try to get the crowd involved and I was happy that the WWE recognised that confidence in him.

Trevor Lee - A real throwback wrestler who works beyond his years but shows tremendous aptitude and is highly underrated. I feel like this is one of those rare breed of wrestlers who can work any style of match and understands what it means to play a role as a heel or babyface. My first exposure to him was on PWG where everyone is just trying to pop the crowd, and he was one of the few guys who just went out there and worked a sincere match. As I saw his work in TNA and that southern indie, I've been keeping tabs.

Oney Lorcan - I haven't been keeping as many tabs on Busick, but he was one of those guys I chose to remember after a match he had in Evolve. Again, the indies is all about flashy moves and all sorts of nonsense, Busick is the complete opposite of that and looks like the blandest wrestler to ever emerge. However, Busick was a real student of the game and while he wrestled in cliches, he'd usually find a way to put a twist on each move that actually gave it meaning beyond killing time. I remember the finish was that roll-up sequence you see in every match, but on this occasion, they actually made it a finish and it got a really good response. When he rocked up later and had that killer match with Undisputed Era at one of the Takeovers, it didn't surprise me, his sense of timing is impeccable.

Here's a bonus entry of somebody I thought didn't had it but proved me wrong.

Tommaso Ciampa - Ciampa was one of Cornette's projects in ROH and I didn't see it. He was booked like a monster, but wasn't overly big. He didn't seem to understand how to work a basic squash match and a few years in I thought he was done when he started aping Tomohiro Ishii's style. I was shocked when he got an NXT call-up and was even more shocked when he gave Samoa Joe his best match in the company. Ciampa has come such a long way that it's genuinely made me more forgiving of performers and he's one of those guys that whenever I catch him, I genuinely find myself sitting through his work, no matter how tired I am.

Adam Cole is probably the closest I can say as a guy I watched grow from the start. He started getting pushed in CZW right when I began following it. So I got to see him go from wrestling school graduate to his heel gimmick that got him attention in pwg and roh. I think once he joined bullet club as one of a dozen randoms I stopped caring so I can't say I was with him his whole run. Did love that heel run in czw as he was "just" cruiser champ but felt like the man so a RVD as t.v. champ.

Think it was just straight promo work that drew me in.

Umm..I may have done this wrong. And even if I didn't I'm going to take the Pete approach. Here are a few wrestlers I was down with from Day One....

Undertaker

Kane- Yeah, I turned on him a few years later, and he's sucked from then on, but I was initially down with Kane from the moment he debuted in epic fashion.
*Unless Isaac Yankem counts? In which case, scratch Kane from this list because Isaac Yankem was awful.

Taz/Eliminators/Stevie Richards/Sandman/Raven- ECW Barely Legal is the GOAT show for Day Oners.
*Unless Raven is eliminated for being Scotty Flamingo & Johnny Polo. Polo was all right.....for a manager. Flamingo sucked, period.

Midnight Express & New Breed- My main reasons for watching 1987 NWA. Cool moves + cool themes=Success!

Zeus- Big badass who feuded with Hogan. What's not to like?

Scott Norton- See above, only with less Hogan and more killing jobbers.

Christopher Daniels- Tore the house down with Taka on Shotgun. I followed him online for years after that. The man who got me into non-MD indies.

Prince Nana- Glorious 80s heel at a time when that was going out of style. Would have made a killing had he come around 20 years earlier.

Hanson & Beer City Bruiser- I eventually got tired of both but for a while there these were my main two reasons for watching otherwise lousy ROH tv.

Jeff Jarrett/Val Venis/Mordecai/Probably Others I'm Forgetting- Vignettes are kewl.
*Dean Douglas & Goldust are borderline here. Loved their new characters based on the vignettes alone. BUT I had never cared about either guy in any of their previous incarnations. So I guess they don't count.

Quebecer Pierre/Jean Pierre Lafitte- Day One both times.

Baker, two posts an no mention of Ludvig Borga? Is everything okay?

I started following ROH at the peak of its popularity back in 2004, so I dove into the CM Punk/Raven feud mid-way. I liked what I was seeing, but then he dove right into his infamous feud with Samoa Joe and I was along for the ride. Been a huge fan of both ever since.

Following Joe led me to TNA and in 2005 the triple threat match with Christopher Daniels and AJ Styles. Add two more guys that I've followed as close as I can since that day.

I was fortunate enough to meet Christopher Daniels a few years ago thanks to the always generous iron maiden and that was easily a top 3 wrestling moment for me. I was so happy to shake his hand and get to tell him that he's one of my all-time favourites and he seemed genuinely glad to hear it. Was also super patient while maiden tried to get a non-blurry photo for me.

...

Only other one that comes to mind is Rob Van Dam. I started watching ECW when he was TV Champ and that run was something else. He was so casual but so talented in the ring and charismatic without even trying. Instant fan.

Nov 28, 2018 18:48:58 GMT 🤯 said:

Baker , two posts an no mention of Ludvig Borga? Is everything okay?

lol I actually was not an instant Ludvig Borga fan. In fact, I thought he was rather lame for those first few weeks. He debuted cold with no vignettes and won his first few matches with weak stuff like an elbow drop or clothesline. Plus an evil foreign heel from.....Finland? Huh? It was like in Mighty Ducks 2 when Iceland randomly ended up in the top heel spot traditionally reserved for the Soviet Union. Lord Steven Regal was doing the evil foreigner gimmick so much better than Borga an hour or two earlier over in WCW every Saturday morning.

It took a month or so before I came around on Borga. The Jannetty match at Summerslam and Borga's vignettes around the same time turned me into a huge fan. But those first few weeks were a bit rough. It took a little while for Borga to really find himself. So he was more like a Day Seven guy if we assume each appearance counts as a day. 

Nor is he among my Top 10 all time favorite wrestlers. He simply wasn't around long enough. More like Top 25. 

It was just me and Aaron who liked Miz during his HOORAH days when everyone hated on him. Everyone else in PW jumped on his bandwagon when he got drafted to Raw and became champ. Stood with him throughout even when Triple H tried to change the minds of the fans when he pushed Indy darling after Indy darling.

Outside of Hunter,

Chris Sabin - another day one in TNA, terribly under-rated for what he gave to the X-Division initially, then the MCMG were arguably one of the best tag teams in the world for a period. I felt TNA never full, excuse the pun, pulled the trigger on the 'Guns.

Adam Cole - I didn't see a lot of his run on the independents, but I did see his cameos on the BTE series, then his debut in NXT. Great all round performer in NXT, and an undeniable confidence.

AJ Lee - saw this little thing bounce onto the screen on the original NXT, and was an instant fan for all the wrong reasons. What she would evolve into, was the first true revolutionary of the women's evolution. She changed the (WWE) business, and unfortunately it will never be recognized.

Chris Jericho - watching a WWE Superstars episode on tape delay of approx. 3 or 4 months in late 1999, at some god awful time at night, I saw Jericho debut against The Rock. I was drawn in by the mic work, especially opposite Steph. Charismatic beyond belief and together with Hunter, makes up 1/2 of one of my favourite matches ever, Jericho and Benoit v The Power Trip on Raw.

Not sure why I didn’t share the picture with THE FALLEN ANGEL

imgur.com/a/TRlvK8j

Another Day Oneish guy for me was Rob Van Dam when he first popped up in the WWF in 2001 (at that time in real time I had missed the 1997 ECW Invasion and hadn't really been exposed to him in ECW proper either). He immediately piqued my interest, and kinda even had an instant stranglehold on being my favorite wrestler in 2001.

He remained a big fave probably until his match against HBK in late 2002. From then on, WWE's intent to book RVD poorly enough to sap all his momentum and cool points really started to take effect.

I feel like RVD is probably the last biggest case of what-could've-been as far as a marketing/merchandising machine for WWE a la Hogan and Austin. But instead, by that point, WWE wanted WWE itself to be the main draw... Not any particular individual.

Nov 29, 2018 15:10:46 GMT 🤯 said:

Another Day Oneish guy for me was Rob Van Dam when he first popped up in the WWF in 2001 (at that time in real time I had missed the 1997 ECW Invasion and hadn't really been exposed to him in ECW proper either). He immediately piqued my interest, and kinda even had an instant stranglehold on being my favorite wrestler in 2001.

He remained a big fave probably until his match against HBK in late 2002. From then on, WWE's intent to book RVD poorly enough to sap all his momentum and cool points really started to take effect.

I feel like RVD is probably the last biggest case of what-could've-been as far as a marketing/merchandising machine for WWE a la Hogan and Austin. But instead, by that point, WWE wanted WWE itself to be the main draw... Not any particular individual.

RVD was a slow progression guy for me. Well, technically I was with Robbie V from Day One in WCW. He had the movez before that was really a thing. But he was gone in like a month and I forgot he ever existed for over 3 years.

Anyway, I hated RVD (in the good way) when I first saw him at Barely Legal. Even when he 'sold out' to WWF a few months later I was like "Meh. I don't want this jerk in my beloved WWF. Please send him back down to the bush leagues" (96-97 RVD is very underrated as a heel. His combination of undeniable skill and insufferable douchebaggery was down right HBKesque). I think he grew on me a bit when I saw him take THAT piledriver from Tommy Dreamer at November To Remember 97 but I didn't really come around on him until the (apparently shitty) match with Sabu at ECW's May '98 pay per view. That lead to a tape binge when some guy in AOL's wrestling chat room was all "That match sucked. You need to see their 1996 matches." So I did. And I've been with RVD (mostly) ever since.

The first episode of ECW I ever saw had a Public Enemy & Mikey Whipwreck vs. The Sandman, 2 Cold Scorpio & New Jack cage match (From Gangsta's Paradise) and PE and Sandman were so fucking insane to what wrestling characters were in 1995 that I was Day One ride or die with them. I had forgotten Mikey Whipwreck, Scorpio and New Jack were even involved before 2012 when I actually found out what episode it was that I watched. Picture WCW and WWF in 1995, then stumbling onto ECW and seeing this old school chain link cage and a drunk man sitting on top of, rocking out to Enter Sandman, enjoying a smoke, just before an entire arena goes fucking apeshit and starts dancing to Here Comes The Hot Stepper with PE. It took me YEARS to realize all three kind of sucked.  :lol:


ECW Hardcore TV Results from that show

SPOILER: Click to show

{Spoiler}Beulah's Box promo (Beulah looking hot while Heart-Shaped Box plays in the background)
Steve Austin Steve-A-Mania Promo
The Public Enemy/Mikey Whipwreck vs. The Sandman/Too Cold Scorpio/New Jack (6 Man Steel Cage Match) (Bloody people falling into tables from high places)
The Public Enemy vs The Gangstas Music Video
Steve Austin in ring promo before:
The Sandman vs. Mikey Whipwreck (ECW World Heavyweight Title Match)
Cactus Jack promo (Losing his ear anti-hardcore promo)

Goddamn.

ECW as a whole, Day fucking One.

Great topic, I guess I was too busy with the music polls to notice.

Shawn Michaels- This is still the big one for me as I feel like Nostradamus or something looking back and seeing what became of Shawn. Right when I saw the Rockers break through that curtain on WWF TV back in 1988 I thought there was something to that blonde guy, that often talked about "it" factor. He had a good look and just a different presence from Marty off the jump. I've stated it before but back in 1989/90 one of my legit dream matches was Shawn vs Bret as they were the most dynamic parts of their tag teams in ring (for Bret) and charisma wise (for Shawn.) His status was boosted further when they did the unthinkable (at least to me at the time) and went all in with a singles heel push. The rest of the story is predictable as he went further up the card the more I hated him as I heard all the infamous kliq stories and he legit messed with Bret's career. Came back around on him during his 8 year redemption tour of 2002-2010.

Sting- Coming from seeing the Road Warriors kill people with clotheslines and the Warrior having his certain challenges athletically Sting was like a quantum leap when it came to painted faced supermen. Going from 2 minute squashes for these characters to a full on 45 minute draw and keeping up with Ric Flair blew my mind. Sting became the ideal super babyface from that day forward, a guy with charisma who could work his ass off when called upon.

Bret Hart- He was the kingpin in the dying days of Stampede so I kind of had to like him but like Shawn had a certain look and way about him that read potential star. He was real easy to root for and fun to watch in the ring. Being the true believer I was though I didn't like the heel version of the Hart Foundation but was fully on board with most everything he's done from 1988 onward (a bit out of the loop from late '94-early'97). He was the true reason for me coming back to watch WWF television in 1997 when he turned heel much like when people turned on WCW when they found out Hulk Hogan turned. No greater praise could be said of that heel turn. Also as Kilgore alluded to, bitter Bret today is the best.

Ricky Steamboat- Cool name, cool look and was exciting to watch in the ring in a slow paced landscape of 1980's WWF.

Owen Hart- Rinse, wash repeat. Great babyface presence and kewl moves that in 1986 seemed otherworldy. Brian Pillman could be put in this category too but he had a leg up with his promos, that early stuff with Bad Company was great relatively speaking and he only got better. Sabu and Jushin Liger fit the bill too, they were astronauts as a great man once said. That favorite wrestler list we did a few years back is still my favorite thing we've ever done since being on the forums.

Hulk Hogan- He was Hulk freakin' Hogan in late 1984 when I first saw him, no more needs to be said.

I might think of more later but those were the essential ones.

I can't resist, I'll shamelessly copy Kilgore and post my first in ring experience with ECW and note the highlights of guys I took a shine too or need some comments said about them.


Hardcore Heaven 1996

June 22, 1996 in Philadelphia, PA

ECW Arena drawing 1,250

Shane Douglas pinned Mikey Whipwreck (11:33).
JT Smith & Little Guido beat Buh Buh Ray & Big Dick Dudley via DQ.
Taz beat Paul Varelans (2:24) via submission.
ECW Champ Raven pinned Terry Gordy.
ECW Tag Champs The Eliminators NC The Gangstas.
Axl Rotten & Hack Meyers NC Samoan Gangsta Party.
Chris Jericho pinned Pitbull #2 to win the ECW TV Title.
Tommy Dreamer pinned Brian Lee in a "weapons" match.
Sabu pinned Rob Van Dam.

Mikey Whipwreck was like a mission statement that ECW was against the grain all the way. What the hell is this twerp doing pushing an established guy like Shane Douglas to an 11 minute match?

Terrible match but Taz's presence stuck with me. Later on his better matches and promos made him an even bigger favorite.

Wrestling keeping up with the times? What the hell? In his own way Raven was like Sabu from a character standpoint. I never saw anything like him before and people are still trying to catch up with what he did.

The Eliminators and Gangstas was like 2 Sabus vs. 2 Ravens. Revolutionary wrestling and characters all rolled into one match. I'm not even going to see what Meltzer gave this match, just seeing these four in the ring together changed my perspective on what wrestling could be.

Jericho was a fine worker who had cheesy charisma. I was a fan but I wasn't going around touting him like I did 1988 Shawn Michaels.  Pitbull 2 had some grit about him that I liked as well.

Tommy Dreamer for the first minute or so with the ring entrance I hated him (loved the song though.) He was a pretty boy gym rat douchey type who turned a switch on once the bell rang and completely turned my opinion of him.

Like Baker I hated Rob Van Dam early on. I just thought the Jean Claude Van Damme look alike was just too much coupled with his name. I didn't fully come on board until the Mr. Monday Night stuff in 1997 but I liked his ring work from the jump.

Nov 28, 2018 14:00:46 GMT Big Pete said:

Unfortunately most of the wrestlers I were into were already 'the' man when I became a fan of theirs. So even though I considered myself a Goldberg fan first and a Pro Wrestling fan second from day one, in reality Goldberg already had a World Championship run under his belt and was just starting to appear in movies. Same goes for guys like Mankind, Rob Van Dam, Billy Kidman etc.

I really didn't start digging further until 2011 or so, since then a few guys who jumped out at me:

Tetsuya Naito - In 2009, Naito and Takahashi toured TNA as No Limit. Now at the time I wasn't going out and buying Tetsuya Naito merchandise, but that No Limit tag team stuck with me and it blew my mind when I realised that one of the guys who worked a couple of fun TV matches went onto main event the Tokyo Dome.

TJ Perkins - TJP has been around for a fairly long time, but he still wasn't a name when I caught him in ROH circa 2011. What stood out about TJP was his attention to detail. Here was a guy who could take all sorts of bumps, but he knew how to lay everything out so every near-fall made sense and the match had a logical progression. In a year where Davey Richards was working 'epics', his match with Perkins always stood out to me.

Michael Elgin - Big Mike was another stand-out from those 2011 ROH shows. What I liked about Elgin was that he came across as a genuine athlete capable of all these feats that would be easy to market and promote. A lot of what he was capable of in the ring was genuinely impressive and it just seemed like he was one big feud off from main eventing. I'm really not sure what happened with Mike, there's all these rumours doing the rounds, but he just never seemed able to bring out of that mid-card level.

Adam Cole - One of the few guys I was there from close to the beginning, Cole was just beginning to break out as a member of Future Shock, but it seemed like he was going to be the Jannetty. However, before he started stealing Jericho's shtick, Cole was one of those guys who excelled at the fundamentals and was surprisingly good on the microphone. He was still pretty green at the time so while he and Kyle were having killer matches with the Wolves and Bucks it seemed like he'd be a ways off, he went and had this match with O'Reilly where he started bleeding from the mouth and played up to it that made me believe he'd be a star.

Dalton Castle - Caught him when he rocked up in CHIKARA as Ashley Remmington and thought he was insanely good for a curtain jerker. His mannerisms playing a ship captain was out of this world and while he didn't display anything incredible in the ring, I thought he showed tremendous restraint which is rare on the independents. When he initially rocked up in ROH I didn't recognise him, but I was instantly drawn in by the character and thought ROH were onto something. It's funny because ROH had Donovan Dijack who is pretty much the prototypical wrestler, but I was all for Dalton, while Bake was all for Beer City Bruiser.

Lio Rush - Honestly good for him becoming a manager and becoming a bigger star than he was ever going to be as a Cruiserweight, but I'm still bummed he's going to be perceived as a manger from this moment forward. At the time, it seemed like every high flying cruiserweight was doing dives for the sake of dives, so when Rush actually started displaying personality in the ring, I became a fan. He was one of the few guys in ROH who wasn't afraid to experiment with the formula and would actually try to get the crowd involved and I was happy that the WWE recognised that confidence in him.

Trevor Lee - A real throwback wrestler who works beyond his years but shows tremendous aptitude and is highly underrated. I feel like this is one of those rare breed of wrestlers who can work any style of match and understands what it means to play a role as a heel or babyface. My first exposure to him was on PWG where everyone is just trying to pop the crowd, and he was one of the few guys who just went out there and worked a sincere match. As I saw his work in TNA and that southern indie, I've been keeping tabs.

Oney Lorcan - I haven't been keeping as many tabs on Busick, but he was one of those guys I chose to remember after a match he had in Evolve. Again, the indies is all about flashy moves and all sorts of nonsense, Busick is the complete opposite of that and looks like the blandest wrestler to ever emerge. However, Busick was a real student of the game and while he wrestled in cliches, he'd usually find a way to put a twist on each move that actually gave it meaning beyond killing time. I remember the finish was that roll-up sequence you see in every match, but on this occasion, they actually made it a finish and it got a really good response. When he rocked up later and had that killer match with Undisputed Era at one of the Takeovers, it didn't surprise me, his sense of timing is impeccable.

Here's a bonus entry of somebody I thought didn't had it but proved me wrong.

Tommaso Ciampa - Ciampa was one of Cornette's projects in ROH and I didn't see it. He was booked like a monster, but wasn't overly big. He didn't seem to understand how to work a basic squash match and a few years in I thought he was done when he started aping Tomohiro Ishii's style. I was shocked when he got an NXT call-up and was even more shocked when he gave Samoa Joe his best match in the company. Ciampa has come such a long way that it's genuinely made me more forgiving of performers and he's one of those guys that whenever I catch him, I genuinely find myself sitting through his work, no matter how tired I am.

I’m surprised Elgin gets booked anywhere with all the stuff that came out about him, in this day & age.

Nov 30, 2018 15:39:09 GMT System said:

Nov 28, 2018 14:00:46 GMT Big Pete said:

Unfortunately most of the wrestlers I were into were already 'the' man when I became a fan of theirs. So even though I considered myself a Goldberg fan first and a Pro Wrestling fan second from day one, in reality Goldberg already had a World Championship run under his belt and was just starting to appear in movies. Same goes for guys like Mankind, Rob Van Dam, Billy Kidman etc.

I really didn't start digging further until 2011 or so, since then a few guys who jumped out at me:

Tetsuya Naito - In 2009, Naito and Takahashi toured TNA as No Limit. Now at the time I wasn't going out and buying Tetsuya Naito merchandise, but that No Limit tag team stuck with me and it blew my mind when I realised that one of the guys who worked a couple of fun TV matches went onto main event the Tokyo Dome.

TJ Perkins - TJP has been around for a fairly long time, but he still wasn't a name when I caught him in ROH circa 2011. What stood out about TJP was his attention to detail. Here was a guy who could take all sorts of bumps, but he knew how to lay everything out so every near-fall made sense and the match had a logical progression. In a year where Davey Richards was working 'epics', his match with Perkins always stood out to me.

Michael Elgin - Big Mike was another stand-out from those 2011 ROH shows. What I liked about Elgin was that he came across as a genuine athlete capable of all these feats that would be easy to market and promote. A lot of what he was capable of in the ring was genuinely impressive and it just seemed like he was one big feud off from main eventing. I'm really not sure what happened with Mike, there's all these rumours doing the rounds, but he just never seemed able to bring out of that mid-card level.

Adam Cole - One of the few guys I was there from close to the beginning, Cole was just beginning to break out as a member of Future Shock, but it seemed like he was going to be the Jannetty. However, before he started stealing Jericho's shtick, Cole was one of those guys who excelled at the fundamentals and was surprisingly good on the microphone. He was still pretty green at the time so while he and Kyle were having killer matches with the Wolves and Bucks it seemed like he'd be a ways off, he went and had this match with O'Reilly where he started bleeding from the mouth and played up to it that made me believe he'd be a star.

Dalton Castle - Caught him when he rocked up in CHIKARA as Ashley Remmington and thought he was insanely good for a curtain jerker. His mannerisms playing a ship captain was out of this world and while he didn't display anything incredible in the ring, I thought he showed tremendous restraint which is rare on the independents. When he initially rocked up in ROH I didn't recognise him, but I was instantly drawn in by the character and thought ROH were onto something. It's funny because ROH had Donovan Dijack who is pretty much the prototypical wrestler, but I was all for Dalton, while Bake was all for Beer City Bruiser.

Lio Rush - Honestly good for him becoming a manager and becoming a bigger star than he was ever going to be as a Cruiserweight, but I'm still bummed he's going to be perceived as a manger from this moment forward. At the time, it seemed like every high flying cruiserweight was doing dives for the sake of dives, so when Rush actually started displaying personality in the ring, I became a fan. He was one of the few guys in ROH who wasn't afraid to experiment with the formula and would actually try to get the crowd involved and I was happy that the WWE recognised that confidence in him.

Trevor Lee - A real throwback wrestler who works beyond his years but shows tremendous aptitude and is highly underrated. I feel like this is one of those rare breed of wrestlers who can work any style of match and understands what it means to play a role as a heel or babyface. My first exposure to him was on PWG where everyone is just trying to pop the crowd, and he was one of the few guys who just went out there and worked a sincere match. As I saw his work in TNA and that southern indie, I've been keeping tabs.

Oney Lorcan - I haven't been keeping as many tabs on Busick, but he was one of those guys I chose to remember after a match he had in Evolve. Again, the indies is all about flashy moves and all sorts of nonsense, Busick is the complete opposite of that and looks like the blandest wrestler to ever emerge. However, Busick was a real student of the game and while he wrestled in cliches, he'd usually find a way to put a twist on each move that actually gave it meaning beyond killing time. I remember the finish was that roll-up sequence you see in every match, but on this occasion, they actually made it a finish and it got a really good response. When he rocked up later and had that killer match with Undisputed Era at one of the Takeovers, it didn't surprise me, his sense of timing is impeccable.

Here's a bonus entry of somebody I thought didn't had it but proved me wrong.

Tommaso Ciampa - Ciampa was one of Cornette's projects in ROH and I didn't see it. He was booked like a monster, but wasn't overly big. He didn't seem to understand how to work a basic squash match and a few years in I thought he was done when he started aping Tomohiro Ishii's style. I was shocked when he got an NXT call-up and was even more shocked when he gave Samoa Joe his best match in the company. Ciampa has come such a long way that it's genuinely made me more forgiving of performers and he's one of those guys that whenever I catch him, I genuinely find myself sitting through his work, no matter how tired I am.

I’m surprised Elgin gets booked anywhere with all the stuff that came out about him, in this day & age.

Okay you can't post something like this and not give details. I know when he was at the height of his ROH push he wanted to go play baseball or some nonsense, but I take it you're not referring to his love of forming an unbreakable battery with a proper catcher?

Yeah, gotta share the juicy deets. Don't tease!

Daniel Bryan after his nXt elimination interview with Matt Striker.
Orton after RNN reports
Gail Kim her WWE debut with that Matrix entrance
Shield debut for Seth Rollins. I remember laughing when Tyler Black last was in ROH claiming how he was going to be a big thing on Raw.

Wasn't it something along the lines that one of his students sexually assaulted a woman and Elgin tried to cover it up?

Dec 1, 2018 2:27:36 GMT Big Pete said:

Wasn't it something along the lines that one of his students sexually assaulted a woman and Elgin tried to cover it up?

www.fightful.com/wrestling/michael-elgin-hot-water-following-scepticism-sexual-assault-victim-s-story-trashes-jeff-cobb-direct

There’s this, plus a lot of lovely texts like this got leaked.

Damn that's ugly. I wasn't sure of the details, but I remember there being murmers as far back as 2013 that Elgin wasn't exactly somebody you'd want front row centre in your promotion.

The sexual assault stuff is terrible, as is Elgin playing up on his missus, but the Cobb stuff never fazed me. That just seemed like unnecessary piling on and a way to try and ostracize Mike from the Pro Wrestling fraternity.

Just to throw a curveball at everyone given my outspoken opinions when I still cared about modern WWE, on paper Prototype/John Cena was a day one guy. I saw his picture in PWI when he first made the top 500 and thought he looked awesome. Then I saw him in the flesh on Smackdown and was never more disappointed.

Dec 1, 2018 7:31:29 GMT Shootist said:

Just to throw a curveball at everyone given my outspoken opinions when I still cared about modern WWE, on paper Prototype/John Cena was a day one guy. I saw his picture in PWI when he first made the top 500 and thought he looked awesome. Then I saw him in the flesh on Smackdown and was never more disappointed.

My dad reading Power Slam
“That Protype guy looks alright”

Me
“Looks pretty average”

Then the hatred began 😂, I was one of those cringy Cena haters during his reign.