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Post by Kilgore on Nov 15, 2017 7:14:46 GMT
AJPW: The Fantastics vs. The Malenko Brothers - July 15, 1989
I apparently downloaded this in July of 2015 and am just getting around to watching it now. I think that's when we were doing a "What the fuck was Dean Malenko doing in the eighties?" thread, which there is very little video documentation of. This All Japan run seems to be most of what exists, with a little footage of him and Joe in GWA Florida, which I think Boris Malenko was running, all around the same time (1988/1989).
Tommy and Dean start things off with some chain sequences with a couple standoffs to polite applause. They then take turns putting each other in armbars with cool theatrics to get out. Deano fucks up his forward handstand exit a little, Tommy nails his standing rope assisted back flip out of it. Shitload of chain reversals, Tommy looks to be waiting for Dean at times, who so far is not yet the Dean that would show up in ECW five years later, but it's still pretty good. Finally they both end up on the ropes, where they do a clean break.
Joe Malenko now in. He immediately takes down Tommy and puts him in some kind of Stu Hart looking neck crank. It's almost a reverse Crippler Crossface, Tommy on his back, his arm between Joe's legs, with Joe in side control wrenching on the back of his head. Joe is way more over than Dean and getting a "Malenko" chant. Tommy escapes, and Bobby is now in. Bobby controls with some sort of standing hammerlock variation, which Joe escapes beautifully by stepping on on Bobby's knee to jump over and out of the lock just before dropping down locking Bobby in a Fujiwara armbar to a pop. Bobby reverses with a head scissors, which Joe then reverse with a bridge and backwards tumble out of it to lock in another armbar of the more regular variety. Joe is really smooth on the mat and is making a habit out of having interesting submissions that I don't know the name of. This one he has butterflied Bobby Fulton's arms for another neck crank.
Dean back in. Fulton locks him up and moves him to his corner and tags in Rogers. He then shoots Malenko out of the corner to a waiting Rogers who hip tosses Dean, and then locks in a Juji Gatame armbar. The mat game is strong in this one, as Fulton comes back in and works Dean's leg with a stepover toehold
That doesn't last long, though. Dean gets back to his feet and hits a snap suplex, looking like the Dean I know for the first time. He then hits this cool spinning sidewalk slam that I don't remember him ever doing in ECW/WCW. Crowd pops.
Joe back in and just owning Bobby Fulton's arm. All kinds of arm submissions including a Juji Gatame of his own.
Dean teases a Texas Cloverleaf on Rogers, but either can't, or doesn't yet turn it over and has a variation of the Cloverleaf. Fulton comes in and punches Dean, who sells it like shit. Dean has been selling most things like shit, to be honest. This was especially bad. It was borderline a no sell. Rogers gets Malenko in the electric chair position, tags in Fulton, who climbs the top and Doomsday Device's Dean-Dean for a 2-and-a-half count!
After some chain sequences, Dean with a Samoan drop, and picture perfect drop kick, and then plays to the crowd (!) indicating something or another. It looks like the beginnings of a Northern Lights, but I can't be too sure as Fulton stops it in its tracks. Dean then wrestles Fulton to the corner and tags in big brother, Joe.
Rogers now in too, who shoots Joe into the corner, and then takes a Bret Hart chest bump into the turnbuckle. Joe surfboards Rogers, Fulton breaks it up, Dean European Uppercuts the shit out of Fulton for his interference.
All four in the ring, the Malenko's get Irish Whipped into each other. The Fantastics hit a double team hip toss on Joe, double punch to Dean coming off the top rope, and double clothesline on Dean after Joe ducks. Joe then hits a single dropkick that takes out both Fantastics to another big pop.
The Malenko's hit a cool double team maneuver -- Joe looks like he's going for a piledriver, Dean wheelbarrels Fulton's legs, and Joe drops down to his knees to sort of Pedigree Fulton while Dean flapjacks him.
Rogers breaks up the count with a double axe handle off the top rope. Fantastics then with a double team flapjack for a near fall.
We approach a big finish with all sorts of action. Dean jumps off Joe's knee into the corner looking like he's going to an Air Sabu, but Fulton ducks and Dean goes to the floor like a sack of shit. Fulton retrieves Dean, Samoan drops him by his corner, tags in Rogers for a Fantastic Flip. Just before the senton lands, Joe shields Dean so Rogers sentons him. Double team whip on Dean, who sunset flips Rogers. Fulton grabs onto to Rogers to prevent Rogers from getting pinned down. Joe knees Fulton, Rogers falls backwards into the sunset flip for a nearfall. Rogers rolls over and gets Dean for a nearfall.
Fulton now in and he shoots Dean into the corner. Fulton takes a sorry excuse for a Bret Hart chest bump, and yes, that was a Northern Lights attempt by Dean before because he hits it now to a large pop and another nearfall. Dean plays to the crowd again signaling for something. Twice in one match! He scoops up Fulton, Fulton drops behind him, Dean awkwardly acts stunned for some reason, Fulton then gives him a swinging neck breaker.
After a couple reversals, Dean gets Fulton's back, tags in Joe. Joe shoots Fulton back to Dean who hits a nasty looking clothesline. Fulton falls backwards into Joe's arms. Dean hits a Bob Holly style dropkick as Joe German suplexes Fulton with a bridge. Dean delays Rogers attempt to break up the count as Joe just gets the three count on Fulton.
Dean and Joe actually show emotion with the win as the crowd chants Malenko. The Fantastics shake their hands, give them a hug, and they all raise each others arms to the delight of the crowd.
Dean Kilgore Grade: C+
That was almost a good match. There was a lot of good stuff in it, but it took a little too long to get going, and Dean was oddly the worst worker of the four and brought the match down a bit. Dean Malenko and The Fantastics, and the star of the match was Joe Malenko. I had seen him work one other time, and it was mostly a worked shoot style, which really plays to catch wrestling grappling style, but he was good at more traditional stuff too, and was a ring general with great timing. The sequence where he shields Dean from the Fantastic Flip was perfectly timed. I like Joe Malenko. He's duller than Dean as a personality, but he could work, and was head and shoulders better than Dean in 1989.
There's a Malenko Brothers vs. British Bulldogs match on Youtube now, which definitely was not up a couple years ago. Maybe I'll check that out in the next two years.
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Post by Kilgore on Nov 15, 2017 7:32:39 GMT
I was reading Bret's book recently and had completely forgotten that the 95 Survivor Series match was inspired by Sabu. Bret didn't like a lot about ECW, but his fandom for Sabu and Balls Mahoney is a weird anomaly. Sabu rules, so there's that. Balls is definitely stranger, but Balls probably could have had a nice career working territories in previous eras. Bret grew up watching Abdullah the Butcher, so Balls probably seemed liked Dynamite Kid compared to Abby. One thing I remember about the book was when Bret wrestled Funk in 1997 in Terry's last Amarillo match, it was mostly ECW wrestlers in the locker room and Bret makes a comment like, "All the up and coming wrestlers with bandages on their forehead, it reminded me a little of Stampede." I get the feeling if ECW stayed 1994 style, still violent, but not as much as it would get, and before Raven style storylines showed Vince Russo what to do, Bret might have repped ECW a little. Any recommendations to add to this bad boy? I'd like to keep it in chronological order(so anything after Summerslam 94), matches that are not already on either of the Bret DVD's, and matches that Bret wins. Bret vs. Savage in Japan in 1994. Good news: It's Bret vs. Savage. Bad news: It's a fancam. As far as fancams go, it's one of the better ones, but it's still a fancam, nonetheless. I'm not sure if that's good enough quality for your VHS masterpiece.
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Post by Big Pete on Nov 15, 2017 10:02:19 GMT
Bret's book is riddled with moments where he speaks out of both sides of his mouth. The book is so big, I wouldn't be surprised if certain sections went through multiple drafts, while others only a couple and it didn't reflect his thoughts on that specific day. One moment he's cursing ECW out, the next he's putting over their most violent performer. It's actually pretty cool that he was prepared to look outside of the WWF bubble and take ideas from Sabu and Negro Casas.
Shin, your masterpiece inspired me to take a deep dive into 1995, specifically a Mantaur vs Bret Hart match from Action Zone. I was surprised to see these two actually had a 10 minute match together and for what it was, it was well put together. Cornette got involved half-way through, tried to get involved again, so Bret used him as a distraction so he could roll Mantaur up. I'm sure Bret just drew on one of his old matches against Yokozuna or Bam Bam, but it was fool-proof.
Action-Zone was a neat show and now all I need is a Rad Radford pog and my night would be complete.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 15, 2017 13:45:39 GMT
Bret's book is excellent. I picked it up a couple of years ago and actually never read the full thing, just kinda skipped around here and there put it up and forgot about it. I'm feeling the urge to break it out again.
Bret vs Savage fancam in Japan sounds perfect for what I'm going for on this tape. I'm definitely going to add that to the list. Was also planning on adding a Hakushi match but wasn't sure which one to go for, I remember that match on Raw was a good one I'll add it.
I actually watched through the Bret vs Shawn rivalry collection they put on the WWE Network almost all day yesterday. The two matches they had in Canada for the IC title in 92 were a lot of fun. Also finally sat down and properly watched Bret vs HBK Iron Man Match from Mania 12(1996). Man I got to say I actually really loved this. Shawn's entrance was so amazing. The match is a fucking grind like Royce Gracie vs Sakuraba in Pride(Shawn going over to shake Stu Hart's hand after the match also similar to Sakuraba shaking hands with Helio Gracie after their fight). Going into the match there was no way Shawn was going to go 60 minutes with Bret, too many times we'd seen Bret wrestle twice or three times on a show, King Of The Ring 93 the ultimate iron man performance in WWF history was just 3 years prior to this. Bret had him in the sharpshooter and it should have been over, they should have kept the clock going if there was to be a sudden death overtime, they broke the hold and stopped the match. Bret walks out of the ring retaining his title and then they changed it up. Just the look of the match and the feel of it is what hit the spot for me, both guys in their primes on the biggest stage for the title, the build up to it was some of my favorite pro wrestling television. This match definitely could have been better, it wasn't a 5 star match or anything, there have been better Iron Man matches maybe but there was just still something about this that I really loved. I'd give it at least 4 stars, great booking with the finish and the controversy.
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Post by Kilgore on Nov 17, 2017 6:14:59 GMT
AJPW: The British Bulldogs vs. The Malenko Brothers - January 29, 1989
Six months prior to taking on The Fantastics, the Brothers Malenko take on another legendary tag team. During introductions, the pop for each participant in order of loudest.
1. Dynamito Kiddo 2. Joe Malenko 3. Davey Boy Smitho 4. Dean Malenko
Davey is now approaching his future braided self in muscularity. Dynamite looks jacked and scrawny at the same time. It's hard to explain. Anyway, both look like they want to murder Boris's baby boys.
On the other side of the ring Dean looks like he's just awoken from a nap. Joe like he's just finished staring at the sun and is having trouble focusing.
Davey and Dean start things off. After Davey starts off overpowering Dean, Dean's technique starts to get the better of Davey. He even hits this head scissors from a monkey flip positioning that sends Davey into his corner to tag Dynamite, to a nuclear pop. Dynamite is basically Hogan in Japan. Dean counters by tagging in Joe.
Dynamite grounds Joe almost immediately, with hammerlocks and neck cranks. After some time, Joe counters with a hammerlock and then a crossface.
Dynamite bullies Joe to a corner, shoulders his body some before making a quick tag to Davey. Davey works Joe's shoulder temporarily grounding him, but Joe drags himself to his corner and tags Dean.
Dean with a wristlock before Davey does his cool roll sequence out of it it, including that boss forward handspring. He twists Dean's shoulder head over heels, and then they both kip up to a delighted audience.
Davey Boy flashing his agility once again as Dean monkey flips him out of the corner, Davey cartwheels onto his feet giving him a look like, "That's right, motherfucker."
Dynamite who hits a shoulder block with more snap than you ever get from shoulder blocks. Dynamite hits a snap suplex that the crowd pops for as Dynamite is setting it up. It's easy to forget how fucking cool a snap suplex still was in the eighties.
The Bulldogs take turn working Dean's left shoulder. Dean reverses a Davey Boy whip to the corner and then hits a (sort of) reverse frankensteiner. Davey Boy takes it as a back bump instead of the back flip spike that you would see today. Dean goes for a pin, and a Davey Boy kick out sends Dean flying to the other side of the ring.
Joe gets the tag. I don't know why, but it cracks me up every time Joe gets tagged because fans just start yelling "JOE!" like he's Norm from Cheers. Joe hits a cool little pinning combination, but Davey kicks out and gets Dynamite back in.
Joe counters out of a hammerlock with the Tommy Rogers standing rope assisted back flip, floats over Dynamite's back and takes him down with an ARM DRAG. Joe and Dynamite have a bunch of reversals out of full nelsons, each one cooler than the last. Dynamite finally says, fuck it, and locks in the Juji Gatame ARM BAR. Joe can't escape, so he grabs Dynamite's foot, and bends his ankle across his knee. Dynamite gives up the hold in pain, then crawls to the ropes for a restart.
Joe goes for a Tombstone Piledriver, which is the worst idea ever against Dynamite, who obviously reverses it into a Tombstone Piledriver of his own. Pre-internet. Maybe Joe hadn't seen the Tiger Mask matches.
Davey in, first working on Joe's shoulder, and then splitting Joe's legs into this painful looking split move. Picture the Rings of Saturn, but on someone's legs.
This pisses Joe off, who then locks in some sort of hammerlock with his legs that I have no idea the name of. He then rolls around the ring keeping it locked in for extra effect. Cool spot as Davey Boy lifts Joe up with the one arm in the Hammerlock, hoists Joe up to an electric chair position, and drops Joe backwards where the impact releases the hold. Davey Boy's new muscles work.
Dean now in, who eventually hits a picture perfect Northern Lights Suplex. It's hard to imagine anybody was doing it better in 1989. After a top rope drop kick from Dean-Dean goes ary, Davey Boy puts him in the Gory Guerrero special.
Dynamite and Davey Boy have a few quick tags, with Dean holding his own against both. It's like the Bulldogs are trying to find the one who has his number. Davey back in, and Dean does a cool schoolboy, but releases it to get Davey in a leglock. Dynamite kicks Dean in the face, but Dean sort of no sells it (Dean no sold a lot in those days, it seems).
Joe in, who does a step over toe hold, and bridges backwards with it. He then somehow floats over into a half Boston crab. Joe's a beast on the mat.
Then a quick tag to Dean, who locks in a decent STF. Davey is a little too tall for him for it to look great. Davey hops to his one foot not being owned by Dean Malenko at the moment, but Dean slips behind him and hits a picture perfect German Suplex with a bridge. Human Suplex Machine Dean Malenko. Unfortunately, he suplexed him to the Bulldogs side of the ring, so when Davey kicks out he's within reach of Dynamite, who he tags in.
Malenko tries another Northern Lights Suplex, but Dynamite now sees it coming and tries to control Dean with a front facelock. Dean bull rushes him to his corner and tags in his brother.
Joe locks in another hammerlock variation that I don't know the name of. Dynamite escapes and locks in a nasty looking Kimura. It looks legit painful. Joe then reverses that with a Kimura + a head scissors. Dynamite gets to the bottom rope and then shoulder tackles Joe through the ropes as they both fall to the floor. Dynamite gets back in the ring first, and makes a beeline to Davey for a tag. Dean helps Joe back in the ring, to tag himself back in, but Davey cuts it off.
Joe gains a slight advantage, tags in Dean, and they look to do some double team work. Joe throws Davey in the corner, and the looks to whip his brother into him. Davey moves, Dean takes the Bret Hart chest bump, as Davey explodes with a Lariat on Joe.
Davey, not realizing Dean is the legal man, sets his sights on Joe. He does the Bulldog Slam, and then tags in Dynamite to do the press slam rocket launcher with Dynamite, but as he has Dynamite hoisted, Dean dropkicks Davey in the chest, and both Dynamite and Davey fall over the top ropeand to the outside floor.
Apparently no one remembers Dean is the legal man, as Joe goes to the outside, throws Dynamite back inside the ring, and goes to work with some stiff looking forearms. Remember when I said it's hard to imagine anybody doing a Northern Lights suplex as good as Dean in 1989? Joe Malenko's is just as good, as he gets a nearfall on Dynamite. Dynamite's nose is now busted open so those Joe Malenko arms were as stiff as they looked.
The two struggle to get the upperhand as they both go for suplexes, only to be countered into attempts by the other. Just when it looks like Dynamite will hit another snap suplex, Joe steps inside on him and nails him with a Fisherman Suplex, perfectly bridged and all. Another nearfall.
Joe goes for a victory roll, but Dynamite sits down on it for the pin. It's the Bret-Owen Wrestlemania X finish! Joe kicks out at 3.1.
The British Bulldogs are your winners of the match, but it looks they've taken more of the damage, referee checking on Dynamite's nose as Dean and Joe look on stoically like they didn't just wrestled a 25 minute match. The Bulldogs converse, deciding if they're going to initiate a handshake with the brothers. They do. A couple bro hugs, and Davey even with a Japanese bow just before they leave the ring. The Malenko Brothers lift up each other's arms to an eruption. They've won in a loss.
Dean Kilgore Grade: B+
That was a really fun match. It was very mat heavy, but the holds looked really good. Everything was a struggle, and the little bit of blood from Dynamite at the end added to the realism that the match excelled at the 20 minutes prior to the color. Dean must have an off night against the Fantastics because this match was before then, and he looked like the finished product that would show up in ECW five years later. Dean worked Davey a lot, and I found it interesting to watch because it gave a glimpse of what Dean would look like as a midcarder in the big two in those days, and I don't think it would have looked too out of place, especially in WCW. As I was watching Joe, he reminded me a bit of a much smoother Steven Regal. He walks a little like Regal, but his moves, which are similar to Regal's, aren't in that odd slow motion time warp of Regal, and look much better. How's that for an unpopular, try hard opinion on an internet message board? Joe Malenko > Steven Regal. Dynamite was a bit past his prime, but still a helluva worker. Davey Boy is clearly on the ascent to his peak. I could see why he'd want to go solo soon after.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 17, 2017 6:56:59 GMT
Nice. Definitely watching that soon.
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Post by Big Pete on Nov 17, 2017 8:54:03 GMT
Recently watched through Survivor Series 2000.
If you cut the show off at Austin stunning HHH, it would have been a solid show. Unfortunately, the entire show is tainted with one of the dumbest spots in WWF history. So in a repeat of last year, HHH tries to set Austin up for another hit and run, only for Austin to be one-step ahead. Austin mans a crane, hoists the car HHH is in up in the air, then drops it to the ground, with the roof smashing into the ground. Not only is the spot dumb on paper, but the post-production was laughable, with some of the worst B-grade cutaways imaginable. It was just the topper to an already ridiculous storyline which included assassination attempts and drive-by sledgehammer attacks.
While the roster was stacked around the time, creatively the company wasn't in great shape. The Undertaker was in the midst of a mid-life crisis and started wearing Zubaz to cope. Kane had become so emotionally scarred at this point, that spilled coffee was enough to send him in a frenzy. And Right To Censor were the biggest heels in the company, need I say more?
In spite of this, the show actually delivered. With few exceptions, every match delivered to it's potential and it was an easy show to get through. The best match of the night saw a fired-up Rock take on Rikishi in a match that the crowd was just molten for. This could have easily sucked, but both guys brought it and the match flowed together nicely. That was followed up by the WWF Championship match between The Undertaker & Kurt Angle. Despite being in a career-low point as a character, Taker turned it on for the show and had a fun smoke and mirrors match with Kurt. Everyone remembers the match for the finish, and I'm pleased to say it holds up. They did a great job of putting that Eric Angle spot together and watching Kurt weasel his way to another title defence was great.
The only real disappointment of the night was Jericho-Kane. Both guys worked hard, but they were blowing spots left and right, and the match suffered as a result. This was a good opportunity for Jericho to show his range, as the match was designed for Jericho to fight above his weight. The problem was that Jericho couldn't get his timing right and that didn't translate effectively.
This show for me is what happens when bad creative gets in the way of quality talent. This should have been an all-time classic show, but due to the bait-and-switch year long angle, we would have to wait until Wrestlemania X-7 to see what this roster was capable of.
With that show out of the way, I'm planning on going through some of these ECW Supercards/PPVs from 1999. Meltzer was down on the company around this time, so I'm interested to see this period for myself.
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Post by Baker on Nov 17, 2017 14:31:25 GMT
I have never seen a Joe Malenko match. Kilgore's recent reviews have me wanting to watch a Joe Malenko match. So here we go.
Joe Malenko vs. Masa Fuchi- AJPW 8/13/89
I have also never seen a Masa Fuchi match. He looks old and has the size advantage on Joe, who unsurprisingly bears a striking resemblance to Dean from certain angles.
Match is joined in progress with Joe trapped in an armbar. Both guys are selling pretty heavily so I imagine this has already been going on for a while. They spend a lot of time on grounded armbars. Sometimes Joe will counter with a headscissor or armbar of his own. Then Fuchi will inevitably lock on another armbar variation. I liked it at first as their was real struggling going on but it got old after a while. Joe didn't break out any of the fancy submissions mentioned in Kilgore's reviews. Then we get some sloppiness, if not outright botches, once the armbar/mat wrestling segment is done. Fuchi hits a missile dropkick and whiffs on a regular dropkick. There's a badly botched german suplex. Fuchi soon hits a subpar back brain kick. Then we get a very ugly Fuchi back suplex where Joe didn't go up at all. And Joe comes back to immediately hit a Northern Lights Suplex for the win. That was odd. Maybe the botched back suplex was supposed to be a Russian Leg Sweep counter? I dunno.
Verdict- Extremely disappointing. Downright bad. The early stages were far from thrilling and then things got sloppy. I was expecting much more from Joe. Either Joe had an off night or Fuchi just sucks. The latter doesn't seem to be the case based on a brief search so we'll chalk it up to an off night for one, or both, men.
There's a Joe/Kobashi(!) vs. Furnas & LaFon match on Youtube. Looks promising on paper. Will check it out later.
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Post by Baker on Nov 18, 2017 3:58:57 GMT
Akira Taue vs. Tommy Dreamer- AJPW 1/19/95Emperor reviewing this in his All Japan thread (which everyone should read) reminded me of its existence and I figured I'd give it a shot as it's a curiosity I always wanted to see back in the Dark Ages before wrestling became so widely available on the internet. A shirtless Dreamer is out first wearing a fancy white robe and basic red tights which look very odd on Tommy. I doubt he ever wore them before or after this tour. Taue is out next also wearing red tights. Unlike Dreamer, red tights are the norm for Taue. I've seen Taue before but not a ton of stuff. I've even seen him in some good matches but those were mostly due to his partner (Kawada) and opponents (Misawa & Kobashi). I find Taue himself to be a very awkward wrestler. I'm told he's an acquired taste. He also has that weird Giant Baba style body. Yikes. This is really bad- heatless, dull, and sloppy- Emp might have been generous in going *. Dreamer frankly looked awful. Everything he did looked like crap. Two terrible dropkicks. Weak clubbering. Several poorly executed 'fancier' moves. Stumbling around when he was supposed to land on his feet after a suplex escape. Thought I even heard the crowd laugh at one point. Taue was super generous in selling as much as he did for Dreamer's straight out of wrestling school offense. Taue finally ends the pain in under 5 minutes with his patented chokeslam. The only "good" (and I use that term generously) thing about this match is a Taue abdominal stretch where he goes for the leg as wrestlers sometimes do to make the ab stretch more effective and Dreamer (probably unintentionally) moves his leg out of the way to avoid Taue's grasp. Verdict- 1/2* Likely the worst Dreamer match I've ever seen. He didn't seem comfortable at all. Had to suck for Taue going from wrestling the likes of Misawa, Kobashi, Hansen, Doc, etc. to wrestling a green Tommy Dreamer seemingly suffering from stage fright.
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Post by Baker on Nov 19, 2017 0:19:02 GMT
Kenta Kobashi & Toshiaki Kawada vs. Stan Hansen & Rob Van Dam (AJPW 2/19/93)
All Japan week on PW continues in this battle of odd tag teams. Hansen & RVD is weird enough but I did a double take when I saw the opposing team as I only know Kobashi & Kawada as rivals. Turns out they were on the same "side" (along with Misawa) at the time. Kawada would switch sides a short time later when he started teaming with Taue.
RVD is looking young here with a slightly different hairstyle than you're used to and a bland, non-airbrushed singlet. He's also wrestling barefoot which made me guess this match took place around his "Robbie V" run in WCW. That's when I looked up the date and it turns out it was actually DURING that run. Rob would also put on about 20 pounds of muscle as time marched on. He acquits himself much better than Dreamer and even gets some nice pops for Rolling Thunder, a standing moonsault, and a missed 450 splash. The only big flaw in his game here is some goofy looking karate which Kawada no sells (more on that later) complete with weak, silly chops that should be accompanied by a "hiya" sound effect. Props to Mick Foley for that one.
RVD starts the match for his team only to tag Hansen within seconds. Crowd comes alive for big Stan getting involved.
Kawada was the star of the match as he wrestled the bulk of the bout for his team with Kobashi only coming in to give RVD a breather and get in a few nice, but far too short, chop battles with Hansen. The big take from this is being reminded how much I would hate to wrestle Toshiaki Kawada. He's right up there with Low Ki, Buzz Sawyer, New Jack and a few others as guys I would absolutely hate to face. He takes some serious liberties with RVD that went far beyond the usual veteran roughing up a youngster in order to test him. It was like a wrestling snuff film at times. First he tries spinkicking RVD's head off and nearly succeeds. Later we get a clothesline with the same intended effect which RVD "sold" magnificently, assuming he was selling at all. Then there are random other full force kicks. And finally, to put any doubts to rest, Kawada hits a brutal knee off the ropes to RVD's back that I've never seen done quite that way in a wrestling ring. It's the sort of thing I imagine Ole Anderson doing when he's trying to cripple a young trainee. All this liberty taking got me legit invested in the match. I was hoping for RVD (or more likely Hansen) to come back and kick Kawada's ass for real. Hansen's saves of his partner also went beyond typical "wrestler saves his partner" stuff to "Whew! Thank god for Hansen saving RVD from a trip to the emergency room." Just when I start thinking Kawada was going easy on Hansen due to respecting a veteran, or something like that, he kicks him full force once or twice as well. Hansen eventually brings a chair in the ring but Kawada STILL gets the better of him and knocks him to the floor where he would remain as Kawada finally puts RVD away with a powerbomb after coming close with THAT clothesline and two Dragon Sleeper type moves.
Had I been smartened up and watching in '93, I'd have tuned in to the next show desperately hoping for somebody, anybody to kick that jerk Kawada's ass.
Verdict- *** Kawada as basically a Japanese Holly or JBL roughing up a greenhorn got me invested. Hansen played his role well. RVD sprinkled some nice high spots in when he wasn't being assaulted by Kawada. Could have used more Kobashi, who was basically a non-factor, but the other three guys brought the goods.
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Post by Emperor on Nov 19, 2017 2:00:15 GMT
You know, when I made my last post in the AJPW thread, I thought that I had seen an RVD match in AJPW. None were documented in that thread, so maybe I was imagining things. Or maybe I watched a pre-94 match featuring RVD. Not sure. I don't think it's that one because your review doesn't ring any bells at all, but I could be mistaken. Kawada is notoriously stiff, but that sounds much rougher than he usually is, even against gaijins beneath his stature. I'll check it out at some point.
It's jarring even for me to see Kawada and Kobashi team together. In the grand scheme of things it wasn't too long before that Kawada was best buddies with Kobashi and Misawa, but having seen so many Kawada/Taue vs Misawa/Kobashi matches, it's like they were never allied.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 19, 2017 13:48:47 GMT
Watched the NXT War Games match in Houston last night. I was skeptical when I seen some of the changes to the rules, first off the cage was open on top and apparently if anyone climbed out they forfeited the match for their team. I didn't like this at first, I liked the roof on the cage and somebody being able to escape a War Games match just doesn't seem right. Once you get in there you shouldn't be able to get out unless you quit. But as the match went on I actually kind of liked being able to do the high spots off the top of the open cage. Also really didn't mind pinfalls being incorporated and I was ok with tag teams being able to enter together.
The part of the changes I REALLY didn't like was the stupid fucking Nickelodeon shark cages that everybody waited in until it was their time to come into the match. They tried to go for some Elimination Chamber stuff with this, the lights would go off and highlight whoever was next, I really didn't like this and I actually felt like this was part of the reason why the early parts of the match were so fucking heatless and the crowd was so dead. It would be so much better if everybody just stayed backstage off camera until it was their time to come out, it builds more suspense and more excitement when you have no idea who is coming out next and their entrance music hits the arena and they come sprinting out to the cage fucking jacked. Instead you got this goofy nickelodeon nonsense and the referee fidgeting with the lock of the shark cage trying to open the door, it was beyond goofy.
But once everybody got into the match it really picked up nicely. I had no idea who anybody in the match was, a few names I've heard in fan fiction before(Adam Cole) but for the most part I was lost on any context or characters, but I still enjoyed the match. Got crazy and violent there towards the end, Houston crowd went ape shit for the tables being brought out. The superplex off the top of the cage was crazy and the finish was good. Damn solid match. I'd probably go 3 & 3/4 Stars, would go higher if the early parts of the match weren't so dead.
I would do away with the shark cages and maybe make the cage a bit bigger to allow some room on the floor around the ring(like the Hell In A Cell), otherwise I didn't mind any of the other changes.
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Post by Big Pete on Nov 19, 2017 15:35:40 GMT
I'm happy you enjoyed it, Shin. It would have been disappointing to see them screw up such a revered match in your backyard. It's also cool that this was your first exposure to Cole, O'Reilly, Fish and Strong. All four featured heavily in those ROH shows Bake and I would review a couple years.
Team Undisputed joined NXT at the last PPV, so they haven't really been established just yet. They're basically the NXT equivalent of the Radicalz where they may as well be called Team ROH, but for obvious reasons they're skirting past that. They tried to recruit their former ROH alumni, Roderick Strong, on one of the recent editions of NXT, only for Strong to turn on them and form a temporary alliance with the Authors of Pain. The Authors of Pain are a well booked hoss team that went undefeated for a long ass time until Sanity beat them for the belts by playing the numbers game and outfoxing them. They're managed by Paul Ellering who cuts promos like he's Vincent Price. It's pretty sweet and I thought his presence on the show was fitting. Sanity are the most established group in NXT. They'd best be described as post-apocalyptic wildlings, who just constantly play the numbers and throw all thoughts of self-preservation out of the window. They're led by Eric Young who is something of an honorary kliq guy. He was a part of TNA's version of the Wolfpac, the Band, when Pac was dealing with some personal problems and Nash/Hall have always been quick to put him over. He's joined by Killian Dain, who made a name for himself on the UK as Big Damo. Alexander Wolfe is from Germany and for a long time was just an enhancement guy on NXT, before Young, Damo and Nikki Cross joined to form Sanity.
Undisputed is very reminiscent of a past stable Cole was apart of called The Kingdom. Like Undisputed, it was a Freebirds rip-off, except the two support guys were Mike Bennett (Mike Kanellis who now works on SmackDown) and Matt Taven. The Kingdom was one of those groups that was pushed more than they deserved to be and never quite made Cole the star he should have been. O'Reilly and Fish at this point in time were teaming together as reDragon, the ace tag team of ROH, but had they been put together with Cole, the whole angle would have translated better than what it did.
Cole and O'Reilly actually started ROH together as tag team partners. They came in together as Future Shock and would often work The Young Bucks before Kyle O'Reilly went into a full-on MMA gimmick with Davey Richards. When Richards was being phased out of the company, they put O'Reilly together with Fish who had just joined the promotion from Dragon Gate USA and they went on a 3-year run together as the premier tag team of the promotion. They toured around the world, most notably in NJPW, where they both worked as singles and tag wrestlers in the junior division, capturing tag gold on a couple of occasions. In late 2015, Fish was unavailable for a few dates, so they paired Cole and O'Reilly back together. This would lead to an angle where Cole would cost O'Reilly the ROH Championship, leading to a year long rivalry where Cole would drop the belt to O'Reilly at the 2016 Final Battle show. Then earlier this year, O'Reilly dropped the belt at the Tokyo Dome, before Cole lost it to Christopher Daniels who won his first ever world championship.
Can you tell I've been reading a lot of Observers of late?
Two shows down on my ECW marathon and while I'll get to them at a later date, I thought I'd just touch on ECW '98. I've been reading through some of the old Wrestling Observers, just to get a general gist and boy was ECW in bad shape around early '98. So many of their top guys are injured. Douglas' body kept breaking down with injuries, Taz sliced his calf on a table and Sandman is so beat down at this point he can barely do a run-in or work the apron in a tag team match. The show is built around Triple Threat with Douglas on top as champion, Bam Bam in the enforcer role and Candido/Storm as begrudging tag team partners. At one point, they hold all the gold, until the underlings drop the titles to Rob Van Dam. Around this time, RVD had another feud with Sabu which involved both guys ruining one another's matches. There was also the WWF Invasion which saw top names like Brakus, Droz and Phil Lafon cause a ruckus in the mid-card. It was about as exciting as the NWA Invasion on USA. I'd imagine the show picks up around the time of Heatwave and November to Remember but there's very few highlights around this time. Really outside of Bam Bam winning the TV Title from Taz (by putting him through the ring) and dropping it to Rob Van Dam in a career defining match, the promotion was in a bad way.
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Post by Baker on Nov 20, 2017 0:20:55 GMT
^That's a great synopsis of the Undisputed Era's (awful name, by the way) ROH careers. Fwiw, my favorite of that trio, or quartet if we're including Strong, is Kyle O'Reilly, who is also the only one I like at all. Emperor Yeah, I'm familiar enough with Kawada to know that he's a stiff, surly bastard even at the best of times. There was the plausible deniability of "Well, that's just Kawada being Kawada, only maybe a little grumpier than usual" until the knee drop off the ropes. That was a blatant cheap shot. While no expert, I've seen a decent amount of the Four Pillars + Dr. Death & Stan Hansen. I mean I know what to expect from those guys at this point. But I had never seen a single Jun Akiyama match.... Until now! Jun Akiyama Sunday
Akiyama was considered the heir apparent to the Four Pillars (Misawa, Kobashi, Kawada & Taue). While he had a successful career, he never quite reached the heights so many had predicted for him. A lot of it is not his fault (the AJPW/NOAH split, the Japanese wrestling business declining in 2000s after boom times in the 80s & 90s) but he definitely falls short of the iconic status achieved by his predecessors Misawa, Kobashi & Kawada. Here I'm going to take a look at a few of his (shorter) early matches against big names to see if I can get a feel for this young, blue-clad warrior. Jun Akiyama vs. Dr. Death Steve Williams- AJPW 1/2/93Akiyama is decked out in his trademark blue attire. His crew cut gives off the aura of this being a nice, respectful young lad. Dr. Death looks the same as he most always did as he never changed his look up since very early in his Mid South days. This is a basic star vs. young low carder match highlighted by stiff Williams shoulder blocks. AJPW has to be the best promotion ever for shoulder blockers what with Williams, Hansen & Furnas all on the roster for most of the 90s. At one point they're out on the floor when Williams backs Akiyama up to the ring post and actually connects with a chop while Akiyama is leaning up against the post. You rarely see "on the post" moves connect and sure enough a few seconds later Akiyama dodges a Williams ring post clothesline providing him with an opportunity. Akiyama works over the arm in a rather dull manner for a while. Williams doesn't really go all out in selling it. So Akiyama's lone opportunity turns out to be not much of an opportunity at all. Akiyama gets a 2 count off an inside cradle that nobody in the crowd bought. Williams picks up the win a short time later with a rather subpar Oklahoma Stampede. Lowlight took place when Akiyama whiffed on a dropkick. Dr. Death was hunched over when Akiyama threw a regular dropkick aiming at where Williams face would be if he had been standing normally. Doc didn't duck or anything. Akiyama just aimed two feet too high. Rookie mistake? Verdict- ** Basic star vs. lower carder action. Akiyama didn't stand out. You could have put any competent wrestler in his role with the same result. Jun Akiyama vs. Stan Hansen- AJPW 9/3/94Akiyama is still decked out in blue but his hair a little more flair here. Now I can see him back talking his parents from time to time and even listening to some dreaded rock & roll music on occasion. Hansen's appearance changed even less than Dr. Death's over the years. He looks exactly the same here in '94 as he did in '80 or '81. If you want a real mind screw go search for some 70s Stan Hansen and if you're very lucky you will find him sporting luscious blonde locks similar to a young Terra Ryzing. This smokes the previous match as Akiyama has a ton of spunk which he showcases right off the bat by rushing Hansen at the bell. Lots of forearms and slaps by the game Akiyama. I mean, yeah, slapping Stan Hansen is the move of a kid with a death wish, but ya gotta admire his heart. The kid has balls. I'm convinced Akiyama should never, ever throw a dropkick when this time Hansen half tosses it away/half no sells. Akiyama actually gets a nearfall at one point with a Northern Lights Suplex. Highlight is Hansen awesomely body slamming Akiyama on the guardrail as Mick Foley weeps for not coming up with that spot first. Stop the presses! An Akiyama dropkick is effective! It knocked Hansen out of the ring. Of course, Hansen then dodges an Akiyama dive seconds later. Hansen also had some killer shoulder blocks and a vicious running back elbow outta nowhere. You don't really see Hansen as an "outta nowhere" type wrestler but he actually is, as his Lariat often came from such a place. Speaking of Hansen Lariats, one ends the match. Verdict- *** This was a good time with a game young babyface throwing everything he had at the veteran legend only to come up short. Jun Akiyama vs. Akira Taue- AJPW 1/20/97Akiyama is a much bigger star at this point. He regularly teams with The Ace Misawa and in fact just had a classic w/ Misawa the previous month against Kawada and the man he is wrestling here, Akira Taue. Akiyama brings the fight to Taue early on much like he did with Hansen. Taue hits a body slam. Akiyama no sells and goes right back on the offensive with forearms and chops. Taue again picks him but this time goes for a Hot Shot. Akiyama awesomely counters it on the way down and goes right back on the offensive yet again. Don't recall ever seeing a hot shot counter like that before. Taue spams the hell out of his big boot. He also goes for his notorious chokeslam from the apron to the floor on two occasions, with the second time being a chokeslam to the exposed concrete floor. Akiyama manages to counter both times. Back in the ring, Akiyama breaks out another very cool counter, this time an armdrag out of yet another Taue chokeslam attempt. And then he wins it with his patented Exploder Suplex a short time later. Big pop for that one which was surely unexpected as we hadn't even yet reached the five minute mark. Verdict- **-**1/2 Fine short match that would have been better had Taue had a wider moveset. It was all big boots and chokeslam attempts. The finish was sort of flukish yet still worked. The US comparison I can think of off the top of my head would be Shelton Benjamin pinning HHH in their first encounter on Raw.
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Post by Emperor on Nov 20, 2017 0:34:54 GMT
A couple of fun modern Akiyama matches are his matches against Shibata and Marufuji. Both in the mid-2000s. The first one was in some obscure promotion. Zero 1 maybe. The other is a NOAH GHC title defense. I think Marufuji was still a junior at the time, so it's an unusual match in that respect. Both are on the short side. I also heard his NOAH feud with Kobashi was awesome, but I've not seen any of those matches.
EDIT: Just tried hunting for these matches online, but they seem to have vanished. I know I watched both of them online not even a year ago.
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Post by Big Pete on Nov 20, 2017 16:20:10 GMT
Survivor Series 2017 The Usos vs The Bar (Sheamus & Cesaro)
Survivor Series was last night and this was one of those mid-card bouts that got lost in all the hoopla. It's the SmackDown Tag Team Champions The Usos taking on Raw's Tag Team Champions The Bar in a battle for brand supremacy.
After watching it again, this was a match that started off really slowly with both sides out of sync, before it came together at the end. Both have had better bouts, but this was a decent effort with a couple of nice highlights. At one point, Cesaro took a sick body drop into the corner that looked nasty live. Then they had this spot where one of the Usos was in position for a reverse Doomsday Device, only for him to catch Sheamus on top and hit a big Samoan Drop off of the shoulders of Cesaro. Then there was the finish with one of the Usos making a flying tag as he wiped out Cesaro near the announcer's desk.
** 3/4. Kind of disappointing all told, but still enough moments to check out if you're a fan of either side.
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Post by Strobe on Nov 21, 2017 14:07:12 GMT
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Post by Baker on Nov 21, 2017 15:03:01 GMT
Kikuchi & Kawada vs. Furnas & Kroffat when I get off work. Be there or be square.
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Post by Baker on Nov 22, 2017 4:52:36 GMT
Tsuyoshi Kikuchi & Toshiaki Kawada vs. Doug Furnas & Dan Kroffat- AJPW 2/22/92
*I'm just going to call Kroffat "LaFon" rather than having to backspace and correct it a hundred times because it'll save time in the long run. When you've been doing something one way for 21 years it's hard to unlearn it in one night.
So Furnas & LaFon did that Eliminators thing by wowing me the first time I saw them at Survivor Series 96 to such an extent that I thought they were the best tag team in the world....based on one match. I was over them within 4-5 months due to WWF booking them poorly + a lack of personality + the fact that their matches with Owen & Bulldog were only ***ish rather than the ****+ instant classics I was anticipating. I knew they were All Japan stars even before their Survivor Series debut but don't think I had ever actually seen them in All Japan....until now!
Watched this the other night. Just hadn't had time to write it up.
Furnas press slams Kikuchi to the floor. Kikuchi takes a nasty bump. Then LaFon Tiger Drivers Kawada on the floor. All this happens within the first 30 seconds. Setting the stage for a real humdinger of a match.
Back in the ring, an already-injured Kawada collapses on a LaFon irish whip attempt. LaFon seizes the opportunity with a quick cover. The hot crowd totally buys into this nearfall. Furnas & LaFon work Kawada over for a little while. Kawada sells well. Weird to see Kawada, who has usually been the aggressor in previous matches I've seen of his, get worked over in such a dominant fashion. Kawada manages to throw LaFon after catching a kick attempt and quickly takes advantage of this opening by tagging in Kikuchi.
Sucks for Kikuchi because he dies over the next ten minutes or so as Furnas & LaFon break out a ton of cool moves on the poor lad. Highlights include....
A super quick snap belly to belly by Furnas. Another gorilla press slam with a painful landing by Furnas- this one into a sea of empty chairs in the crowd. The GOAT Cobra Clutch by LaFon as he isn't going for a mere submission. Instead he's trying to rip Kikuchi's head off. Two extremely painful-looking Liontamers by Furnas that likely caused Kikuchi years of back problems. A sick lawn dart Razor's Edge by LaFon months before Razor Ramon was even a thing. Several stiff chops and kicks. A running superkick by LaFon to Kikuchi in the corner. This reminds me how 'corner kicks' are vastly under utilized in wrestling. This looked awesome. So did Kid's running corner dropkick. Ditto for Savio's corner spinkick. And MVP's running corner big boot. Wrestling needs more corner kicks.
LaFon also hit an awesome snap Perfectplex and Furnas reminded me that he's an all time Top 10 dropkicker with his proto-Dropsault at some point.
And there's probably some more cool stuff I'm forgetting. So, yeah, Furnas & LaFon rule on offense. Their offensive display here surpasses any Midnight Express squash and is at the very least on par with your favorite Steiners match or Eliminators vs. Dudleys from Barely Legal.
Two matches is a small sample size but right now I think Kikuchi is a better Ricky Morton than Ricky Morton. Yeah, Morton was a great seller and a decent enough bumper. But Kikuchi is a great bumper and a fine enough seller. I'm always going to take the great bumper with a grasp of selling over a great seller with a grasp of bumping.
Kikuchi finally makes the hot tag to Kawada and I do mean "hot" as this crowd is all in. At this point it's shaping up to be an all time classic....
But Kawada of all people proves to be an unexpected weak link. His hot tag is rather pedestrian. None of the stuff he did would have ranked among the Top 20 coolest things Furnas & LaFon did during this match. I mean if ever there was a time for Kawada to start....umm....Kawada-ing people, this would have been it. Instead he just seemed to be going through the motions. Furnas & LaFon's stuff also didn't look nearly as good against Kawada as it did against Kikuchi and Kawada even weirdly no sold two LaFon superkicks. We get some nearfall trading with me buying into a Kikuchi diving headbutt nearfall before Kawada traps LaFon in a Dragon Sleeper type move for the win. Big pop but it left me feeling a little empty.
Verdict- ***3/4-**** Recommended. Like I said, this was shaping up to be a ****+ all time classic. Furnas & LaFon brought the awesome offense. Kikuchi took a hell of a beating. The crowd was hot. But Kawada brought it down some during the finishing stretch by not bringing his A game.
If I had to pick one star of the match, it would be LaFon. His offense was a little cooler than Furnas' and he even showed some personality(!) by doing the occasional heel taunt.
This also confirmed my suspicion that Furnas & LaFon were victims of bad timing during their 96-97 WWF run. Just a bad time and place for them considering their style. A few years later and they kill it against Hardys, E&C, Dudleys, APA, etc. They go to WCW then or a few years earlier and they kill it.
It confirmed another suspicion that us 90s wrestling fans were deprived by never getting a Steiners vs. Furnas & LaFon match/feud. It basically would have been Steiners vs. their alternate universe evil counterparts and likely the greatest display of offense in tag team history. They never even met in Japan due to working for rival companies. Oh well. At least we got this and the famous Furnas & LaFon vs. Kobashi & Kikuchi match. Which may be next on the docket. Stay tuned!
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Post by Big Pete on Nov 22, 2017 8:49:21 GMT
ECW 1999 Thoughts
- Tajiri and Super Crazy were the two success stories of the year. They went from no-names, to having the best match on any card and branching out and adding more depth to the undercard.
- Sid had the perfect Sid run. It's amazing how WCW picked him up, and decided to turn him heel and throw him into the thick of a main event feud expecting fans to care. If ECW Sid was in WCW, he would have been a star.
- Taz' reign never really got going. If it wasn't for the invention of the Money in the Bank, I'd argue his championship win at Guilty At Charged '99 was one of the worst ever initial championship victories. His programs against Sabu and Candido were nothing in the grand scheme of things and when finally things heat up against Buh Buh and Tajiri around summer, he's off to the WWF.
- Douglas' retirement tour was awful. Loses to Taz in the most unconvincing way, turns babyface, tries to dress like he's in his 20s, when he looks 35 going on 65 and doesn't put anyone over. Goes over Credible in both singles and tags and the only consolation Credible gets is being able to lay the Franchise out after the match.
- Was never a big Tommy guy, but thought the Dreamer-Storm angle was great and a career highlight for both guys. Was never a fan of the Tammy Lynn Bytch persona for Dawn Marie, but the Beulah shtick was cute.
- Sticking to the positives, I thought the Dudleys were at their best during this period. They get to cut the best promos, show plenty of ass, but when it's all said and done usually get to go over. I would have been down for a Dudley Boyz singles run had they stayed on. They would have pulled it off for sure, especially with Gertner as a mouth piece who was just awesome in everything he did. In our HoW Hall of Fame where Sabu is a first ballot pick, Gertner has to be a fixture.
- The promotion definitely picks up around Hardcore Heaven since Paul E seems to have a focus and just doubles down on what's working. Paul E does a great job of rehabbing Lynn despite losing two major matches against RVD. Corino goes from a fun undercard act, to one of the main guys on the show and is booked incredibly well. He still shows plenty of ass, getting pinned by Francine but since he's positioned so high and is good at his craft, still remains over on the roster. He's still a project for sure, but putting him with Tajiri and Rhino really was a mutual benefit.
- ECW cashing in on the 'women power' movement by booking Jazz strong was well handled. Unlike the WWF and Chyna which was extremely bi-polar, Paul E knew to keep Jazz on the under-card and to pair her up with popular acts like Spike. It worked, even if the Simon Diamond gimmick feels like something out of SmackDown circa 2004.
- I have a new appreciation for Anarchy Rulz. I thought Awesome was more involved with the promotion at this point, but his first PPV back in 1999 sees him take the ECW Championship in a great moment. It was ballsy of Paul E, but it followed that new era theme ECW had going.
- Unfortunately I didn't have either show where Sandman and Raven returned. Their returns seemed to be going against the tide, but they were really well handled. It's a shame ECW just couldn't get their hands on a WCW/WWF ex-pat without any or limited ECW exposure. Could you imagine if the Radicalz came to ECW instead? Or Konnan rocked up with the Cruiserweights in 2000? It would have been a completely different ball-game. I wonder what Dustin Rhodes in ECW would have been like?
- I'm a fan of his podcast, but Callis in ECW was a disappointment. As a member of the Impact Players, he was completely irrelevant and his tenure in the announcer's booth reduced it to a WWF call. The problem is, Joey Styles isn't Jim Ross, he has his own approach and that's what made ECW stand out. As crazy as it sounds, behind Paul E and the Philly faithful, Joey Styles would be one of the most important features of the promotion.
- In terms of a pure 'rasslin' show, neither of the bigs touch ECW. Maybe Benoit, Saturn, Mysterio Jr, Blitzkrieg etc. were able to put enough good matches to take down the promotion, but on the whole WCW was a disaster that killed wrestling as we knew it. However, if you throw main event angles into the mix then the WWF edges it out.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2017 6:40:27 GMT
Big Black Friday sale over at RF Video right now, 40% off all ECW dvd's, most supercards/PPV's are $9 and most fan cam shows are $6. I'm mulling over what to buy. I've got these in my cart to complete my collection:
Hardcore Heaven 94 Hostile City Showdown 94 The Night The Line Was Crossed(94) House Party 98 A Matter Of Respect 98 Cyberslam 99
Browsing through some of the fan cams, I'd like to pick a few up but can't think of any to go for right off hand.
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Post by Strobe on Nov 23, 2017 11:15:51 GMT
Baker got me to revisit that tag and I'm pretty much bang on with him as far as rating and critique. If Kawada had shown more fire on the hot tag and they had a touch more time for the closing stretch, so that Kikuchi didn't have to get back up and be hitting offence quite as quick after that tremendous beating he took, you could've been looking at low-end MOTYC. Kroffat/Furnas really were miscast as faces in the WWF. But I guess there was a problem that you had Owen/Bulldog as a half-Canadian workfare heel team already. And there weren't exactly an abundance of smaller faces for them to work with. If only there had been some young face teams like the Hardys and E&C around for them then. And yes, you should review the Kobashi/Kikuchi match right now. More time, hotter crowd and Kobashi just works better in the big brother role. Up there with the likes of Austin/Dude OTE for most fun match ever.
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Post by Big Pete on Nov 23, 2017 16:19:04 GMT
More of a book review, but Jericho's latest book maybe his best release since his first. Unlike most biographies, this isn't set out in chronological order. Instead it's put together by various lessons, which just gives him an excuse to tell stories. What was refreshing about the book is that he contradicts a lot of things he said on Talk Is Jericho. Whereas he was always positive and putting everything over, Jericho is more candid in his book. He admitted that after 2010 that a lot of his more recent runs were akin to reunion tours and he got tired of putting everybody over. Around this time, a lot of his ideas were being shot down, including one where Shawn Michaels would find himself in Chris Jericho's corner against Bray Wyatt despite their history. HHH and Vince told him HBK would be too busy, but then HBK rocked up and did all the SummerSlam fan axxes stuff so that was a source of frustration.
He then went into his more recent run. Originally he wanted to turn heel and face off against Dean Ambrose at Wrestlemania with The Big Show as his muscle. However, AJ Styles joined the company, so he volunteered to work with him since Vince didn't think much of him. Jericho's goal was to get the Styles Clash unbanned since Vince banned it without knowing what the spot was. So they called the spot at the February show and Vince was impressed it drew a nice reaction. They did it again at Wrestlemania, and once again it drew a great reaction which got Vince's attention and he wanted to use it as the finish for the post-Mania Raw. They did it, then Jericho told Vince it was the Styles Clash and Vince was more comfortable with AJ using it. These days, the move is still used sparingly since the flying forearm is over, but it's been rehabbed into a super-move.
Jericho also spoke about the Asylum match and the only way they could clear the thumb tacks is if they made it a 'first ever' Asylum match. Originally Ambrose was supposed to take the bump, since Jericho was being booked strong for a Roman program. However, Rollins was due back so all of that was nixed so not only did Jericho have to lose, he took the bump which led to 69 tacks being lodged into his body. He wasn't really happy with it, calling the match plodding, but was still happy he did something he had never done before, or something that hadn't been done on WWE TV in 8 years.
Then he went into the 'new' style of wrestling where guys like Cesaro, Zayn and Rollins like to spam moves. Originally he didn't like it since it went against what he was taught, but he was willing to be more open minded. While he still isn't completely comfortable with it, the new style was fresh and he feels like he's gaining more insight into the modern fans.
What works about the book is that Jericho seems to be in a great place. The podcast has been great for him since it's allowed him to reconnect with a lot of his friends and make friends with the guys from KISS who he obviously idolizes. It's a lot less diplomatic than his previous books and seems more reminiscent of a younger Jericho who wasn't afraid to voice his own opinion.
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Post by Emperor on Nov 23, 2017 23:15:25 GMT
Kenta Kobashi & Toshiaki Kawada vs. Stan Hansen & Rob Van Dam (AJPW 2/19/93)
Baker already reviewed this match, so I won't do a full review, just tag on to what Baker said.
I have to disagree with some of this. To me, Kawada didn't look much stiffer or more violent than he does against a lot of other guys. He always hits hard. The spinkick and lariat were among the nastiest ones I've seen, but I'm not sure if Kawada was really stiffing him, or whether RVD was bumping really convincingly, as he is known to do. It looks like the spinkick did connect, but I'm not so sure on the lariat. But I do agree that the diving knee to the back was genuinely nasty. I think his behaviour was a mixture of him thinking RVD was a joke (his reaction, or lack thereof, to RVD's karate kicks was hilarious) and the fact that Hansen was clobbering the shit out of him whenever he got a chance. When Hansen introduced the chair into the match, I was hoping against hope that RVD would bust out a Van Daminator and blow the crowd's mind. But it didn't happen of course.
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Post by Strobe on Nov 24, 2017 0:18:20 GMT
RVD himself said that Hansen as his partner would hurt him more than any of the natives that he faced.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2017 5:06:30 GMT
I'm starting to seriously get that ECW itch back. I just now popped in the November 9th 1993 episode of Hardcore TV that I have on DVD, this was the go-home episode for the November To Remember show. I'm only a couple of minutes into this but man this is so interesting, I've actually never watched this. It's a shame Big Evil never kept his ECW 1993 reviews going, as terrible as the company was there for the first few months of Hardcore TV in 93 the show actually got a lot better going into the end of the year(it still wasn't that good, but for a 1993 wrestling show you know). They are calling themselves NWA Eastern Championship Wrestling(they had just got in bed with NWA at Ultraclash when Heyman took over booking in September) at this point. This episode starts off with such a sleazy little interview with Sheri Martel and Medusa, it's got a big time Jerry Springer daytime talk show sleaze feel to it, I was waiting on them to start pulling each other's hair and then break to start twerking.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2017 4:39:27 GMT
I'm going to have to restart my Bret Hart supertape, there's a few older matches I'd like to have on it that I've already passed up. I watched a few good ones today. On the WWE Network there is an episode of WWF Prime Time Wrestling from 1989 that is like a big infomercial for Coliseum Home Video, this was glorious. It was hosted by Shawn Mooney and Tony Shiavonne, they show various matches from the Coliseum tapes putting them over the whole episode. They showed a really fun match with Bret vs Bad News Brown, from the first Wrestlefest tape I think from 1988. The clip they were showing cut off before the finish, I'd like to see the full match.
Also I watched a little bit of the Bret Hart Dungeon Collection and seen a fucking spectacular Bret Hart vs Undertaker match from like 1991. This was definitely the best match I've ever seen them have, really loved it. Would definitely have to add this one to the supertape.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2017 4:56:05 GMT
And tonight everybody is gone I've got the herb burning watching December 1993 ECW Hardcore TV tapes(on DVD). I started last night with the episode prior to November To Remember and I've made my way into the first episode of December right now. Man these things were such late night infomercials, just constantly selling stuff, hyping upcoming shows, hyping their wrestling school($1,500 down and $500 a month for 3 months!), running ads for how you can get ECW to your school or your town, Carver W. Reed pawn shop ads(this was the shop Todd Gordon owned if I'm not mistaken, plus lots of music videos for wrestlers. They aren't selling t-shirts or VHS tapes yet as far as I can tell but the whole thing is just ECW infomercial, I think I might have seen 2 full matches on the 3 or 4 episodes I've burned through so far. Sabu vs Tasmaniac was a featured match on this one I've got going now, not good. I actually kind a like the ECW infomercial episodes of Hardcore TV though so I'm digging these right now, good stuff for ripping herb late at night writing about rasslin.
I kinda like this Matty guy though, he's like the main hype man for ECW on these episodes, the Extreme Pitchman, he's definitely a hell of a lot better than Lance Wright.
So interesting though seeing ECW at this stage.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2017 7:00:52 GMT
And I've finally figured out how torrents work, got some stuff downloading now. Just browsing what all is available, this... this is...
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Post by Big Pete on Nov 25, 2017 7:05:28 GMT
25/11/17
The first day of the rest of your life, Shin.
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