I need to, but it sounds like such a downer. It being on a lot of critics best of the year lists is motivating me more. My wife started watching so that will help.

(It doesn’t help that I think a lot of that profiling stuff is mumbo jumbo)

4. Game of Thrones 

Season 

7th (7 episodes)

Network 

HBO 

Creators 

David Benioff 

DB Weiss 

Cast 

Peter Dinklage (Tyrion Lannister)

Lena Headley (Cersei Lannister)

Emilia Clarke (Daenerys Targaryen)

Maise Williams (Arya Stark)

Critical 

9.5/10 (IMDB)

94% (RT Critics)

91% (RT Audience)

Fortunately Game of Thrones recovered from a pretty poor season 6 and put on an entertaining 7-episode penultimate series. Jon and Daenerys meeting and their interactions throughout the season was the clear highlight for me. The rest was good, solid drama, but nothing really grabbed me besides the aforementioned. Wasn't into the Winterfell story after Arya arrived. The big battle North of the Wall was spectacular and wonderfully shot as always, but the whole plot of that episode was too contrived and Hollywood-y for my liking. Left a sour taste in my mouth. The final episode was mostly fantastic.

And for me season 7 was a big letdown after watching the whole show before it started. Season 6 felt way ahead of season 7 in terms of character and story while season 7 was all over the place just trying to speed to the end and stuffing too much in.

Emp, you've read all the books haven't you? Did some of the choices the television show make hinder your enjoyment of the show like it did for others? I know the Sand Snakes in particular were a big source of conflict for many, and I doubt the Arya storyline did much for you either.

We're seven seasons deep at this point, and while the show has lost it's luster and started relying more heavily on Hollywood tropes, it's amazing that it isn't a complete and utter mess. The only thing that was on the nose was the amount of fan-service, like Gendry tagging along. Also felt the Sam montage felt like something out of another show - was that the first montage in GoT history? To be fair, the show still delivered a nice gut punch with Euron Greyjoy completely messing up his nieces voyage. I also like how Daenerys risky dragon play ultimately backfired on her, because now the white walkers have one of their own and the mission didn't sway Cersei in the slightest. At most, it may have led to the straw that broke the camel's back for Jamie, but was it worth it?

It's been awhile and seasons do run together, but I don't think any episode in season seven had the same impact on me like Episode 9 and 10 did in Season 6. The finale for Season 6 maybe the best of all-time, and the only issues I can remember from that season was the Arya sub-plot and the slow start.

Mindhunter was right up there in my list. It's just teeming with David Fincher's personality and as somebody who basically grew up on Se7en it's right up my alley. I actually think you'll enjoy it if you're a skeptic of that particular brand of criminology mikec. This isn't a propaganda piece that only promotes the value of the system, merely it points to the possibility than more can be learned about offenders by studying them and their motives. By looking at their psyche, it opens up more clues for future cases and counter-measures that can prevent the chances of such a crime occurring again. Like The Deuce, it also blends reality with fiction, so a lot of the subjects benefit from that dose of reality.

Dec 19, 2017 23:23:37 GMT Big Pete said:

Emp, you've read all the books haven't you? Did some of the choices the television show make hinder your enjoyment of the show like it did for others? I know the Sand Snakes in particular were a big source of conflict for many, and I doubt the Arya storyline did much for you either.

Dorne in the TV show is awful. A lot of people don't like the Dorne arc in the books either, but I think it's interesting. The Dornish characters are big players in the novels, and far from done, but in the show they come across as petty mindless buffoons who will stab anyone in the back - including their own kin - at any given moment. It'd have been better to have not featured them at all (except Oberyn's stuff) than to have them appear and die off in the way they did. At least we got Cersei's revenge speech, which is a great scene. Arya's Braavos adventure were pretty tedious in the books and on TV. It would have been more interesting to watch had I not known in advance where they were going. I had other quibbles with some of the changes they made, but no point in getting hung up on it. The bottom line is that it's mostly an awesome show and they must divert from the source material for various reasons. I gladly accept that.

Still need to catch the Deuce and Mindhunter. GLOW just missed my top 10, quite enjoyed it though. I really enjoyed this season of GoT, was my #1.

Punisher was amazing, finally the exact Punisher I've been waiting for all these years. Lundgren Punisher was an entertaining movie, barely the Punisher. Jane played a great Frank in an underwhelming movie. Stevenson was solid in a movie that had some great punishing, but was similarly underwhelming. Bernthal Punisher delivers on all levels from characters (especially Bernthal, he was born to play Frank Castle) to story, a scarce few lulls, but enthralling throughout. That said, I enjoyed other shows more, landing it #7 on my list, looking back on my list, probably should have rated it one higher though.

Double-checked between posts and GoT was #13 on my list. It had an argument for as high as eighth on my list, but lost out to some shows that I just wound up liking more this year. But I’m not indifferent to the argument that this season of Thrones got a lower score from me because it is competing with itself and the other shows. I’m just sad the season wasted so much time on its primary heroes being dumb, and I’m irritated by how many storylines they have to close out next season because of their lack of story progression. Jon had to learn his parentage, try have to fight the Great War then fight the war with Cersei, they have to resolve Jon and Dany and settle the world and they get fewer episodes next time out right?

So what will make the top 3?

I'd expect Stranger Things, but outside of that it's a complete mystery. I'd say Better Call Saul has a fair chance, but I honestly don't know what else could be there.

3. The Handmaid's Tale 

"

Season 

1st (10 episodes)

Network 

Hulu 

Creator 

Bruce Miller 

Cast 

Elisabeth Moss (June Osborne)

Yvonne Strahovski (Serena Joy Waterford)

Joseph Fiennes (Joe Waterford) 

Max Minghella (Nick Blaine) 

Amanda Brugel (Rita) 

Critical

8.6/10 (IMDB)

95% (RT Critics)

92% (RT Audience)

Globe Nominations 

- Best Television Series; Drama 

- Best Performance by an Actress in a Drama (Moss)

- Best Performance by an Actress in a Supporting Role (Ann Dowd) 

I've never seen , nor do I want to see The Handmaid's Tale. Nothing against the expected quality of the show and I've heard good things about it - but I see or hear enough about the bleakness of this world and the future and I use TV as a brainless escape because they do take up so much of your time than movies. It's why I'm always afraid to start a new series - they are a commitment and you could spend four hours before knowing if you are in or out on a show and with a movie it's two hours (give or take) and you are free.

It happened with Ozark yesterday and it sucks , I could of watched two movies in that time. Then again to be fair it also is how you discover great shows - but I feel they are rare for me.

Anyways none of that is Handmaids Tale's fault , but it is why I probably won't be watching it anytime soon.

Handmaids Tale was fine, it was number nine on my list. I’m not sure why I liked it less the longer it went. I might have become desensitized to the brutality or maybe it just became less interesting the further down the path you got, but the conclusion of the season really knocked it down a few pegs.

It’s looks great and Elizabeth Moss is amazing, but it really lost me somewhere along the line.

Dec 20, 2017 6:29:34 GMT Big Pete said:

So what will make the top 3?

I'd expect Stranger Things, but outside of that it's a complete mystery. I'd say Better Call Saul has a fair chance, but I honestly don't know what else could be there.

I’d guess those two are what’s left, though PW does like Walking Dead. Sad to realize that my number one is almost certainly not on the list.

2. Stranger Things 

“I may be a pretty shitty boyfriend, but turns out I’m actually a pretty damn good babysitter.” ~ Steve 

Season 

2nd (9 episodes)

Network

Netflix

Creators

The Duffer Brothers 

Cast 

Winona Ryder (Joyce Byers)

David Harbour (Jim Hopper)

Finn Wolfhard (Mike Wheeler)

Millie Bobby Brown (Eleven)

Gaten Matarazzo (Dustin Henderson)

Caleb McLaughlin (Lucas)

Joe Keery (Steve Harrington) 

Critical

9.0/10 (IMDB)

94% (RT Critics)

92% (RT Audience)

Globe Nominations 

- Best Television Series 

- Best Performance by Actor in Supporting Role (David Harbour) 

Shame on all of you PW for not voting this #1 , shame on all of you.

When it was all said and done with my list , it wasn't hard at all figuring out what would be my favorite show of the year. Stranger Things was far and away the best television experience I had all year long and is arguably my favorite "entertainment" experience as well - it's really close with my favorite movie of the year. I'd probably give Stranger Things the slight edge though because the euphoria lasted over a few days.

I don't think I can really hate anything from season two , I know the seventh episode has become infamous for a WTF moment from a great show , but I think the episode was more annoying than it was bad. Just my two cents on the matter.


Everything else from season two was fucking perfect though , you have the incredible cast of kids back , the best young cast in television history. You have Winona and David Harbour back and just as on point as they were in season one. The addition of Bob , played by Astin was a great choice that could of went terribly wrong but the show handled it better than anyone could of expected. Reiser was also a welcomed addition and had a nice character arc - just everything that could of went wrong with a season two of any pop culture phenom didn't - they knocked everything out of the park.

And then there is Steve Harrington , the absolute star of the season and my favorite television character of the year without a real close second. His progression from last season to this year has been a real fun watch and if you told me at any point of season one that Steve fucking Harrington would be my favorite character on the show I would of assumed you are a sociopath. Babysitter Steve though - fucking on point and I hope they keep him away from Nancy going forward as his character is just above that. Hell they could send him to college , make a spinoff and I would watch the hell out of that.

Overall though you could gush about any number of the characters , the show does such a tremendous job of writing these characters that you feel everything they do. The joy , excitement , terror , sadness , anger - everything. That moment in the end of the show with Dusty at the school dance was one of the most emotional for me - and that speaks to how much I care for the character. A middle school dance means as much to fans of the show as fighting a fucking shadow monster.

Oh and Elevens eventual return and save the day was the ultimate mark out moment of television for me , even though everyone knew it was coming - I still jumped out of my seat with a fist pump and was stoked. It's few and far between a television show or movie can illicit such a reaction out of me but Stranger Things did , because it is awesome. I'm sure people out there nitpick the hell out of it , I don't because I don't need to - I just watch and smile because it's everything I could ask for from a series.

I have absolutely zero doubt that I would really enjoy Stranger Things - I just haven't started to watch it yet.

Dec 21, 2017 17:18:04 GMT PB said:

I have absolutely zero doubt that I would really enjoy Stranger Things - I just haven't started to watch it yet.

Wife & I just started with Season 1 this week. We're up to Episode 3. We're on board. Only drawback if we can't binge because Wife says it's too scary/creepy for her to handle any more than one episode per night.

I really liked season two, but the build was slow and it took a little bit to warm me up to the season and though I liked quite a bit the first “Yeah this show is really cooking now!” came right before an episode that completely left the scene and spent an hour somewhere else with crummy characters. The last two were terrific though, the Steve Dustin stuff was great, and it resolved well.

I just found myself very nit picky of season two (the stepbrother of the new girl was MISERABLE for instance), so it just couldn’t beat out a few absolutely dynamite shows.

I’m a little worried that my number one nor Better Call Saul will be number one and that’d be awfully sad for me.

I never thought Better Call Saul would be this high, which means it may not rank, which means I'll be really sad.

Dec 19, 2017 21:07:38 GMT Emperor said:

Fortunately Game of Thrones recovered from a pretty poor season 6 and put on an entertaining 7-episode penultimate series. Jon and Daenerys meeting and their interactions throughout the season was the clear highlight for me. The rest was good, solid drama, but nothing really grabbed me besides the aforementioned. Wasn't into the Winterfell story after Arya arrived. The big battle North of the Wall was spectacular and wonderfully shot as always, but the whole plot of that episode was too contrived and Hollywood-y for my liking. Left a sour taste in my mouth. The final episode was mostly fantastic.

Season 6 was awesome, especially after the dogshit that was Season 5.    Battle of the Bastards and Cersei blowing up the Sept of Baelor are my two favorite final episodes of any season.   

I enjoyed season 7 as well, but I agree with MikeC  that it was rushed.   Would have been better had they done a full 10 episodes and really fleshed it out. 

Dec 21, 2017 23:42:50 GMT PB said:

I never thought Better Call Saul would be this high, which means it may not rank, which means I'll be really sad.

That’s kind of my thought too, though you me and Pete seem to have ranked it.

Dec 21, 2017 23:42:50 GMT PB said:

I never thought Better Call Saul would be this high, which means it may not rank, which means I'll be really sad.

Not that I want any spoilers per se, but is Season 3 as good as or better than Seasons 1 & 2? I just wrapped up Season 2, and have loved both seasons so far. I have high expectations for Season 3, both because of how good/how much I enjoyed Seasons 1 & 2, and also because of how Breaking Bad conditioned me. If Season 3 dips, I'm gonna be a lil sad.

Season 3 was the best yet in my opinion.

Dec 22, 2017 1:41:10 GMT 🤯 said:

Dec 21, 2017 23:42:50 GMT PB said:

I never thought Better Call Saul would be this high, which means it may not rank, which means I'll be really sad.

Not that I want any spoilers per se, but is Season 3 as good as or better than Seasons 1 & 2? I just wrapped up Season 2, and have loved both seasons so far. I have high expectations for Season 3, both because of how good/how much I enjoyed Seasons 1 & 2, and also because of how Breaking Bad conditioned me. If Season 3 dips, I'm gonna be a lil sad.

Season 3 is my favorite. I thought one and two were really solid but not great (usually in the bottom half of my top ten for the year) and that most of Season 3 was great. I don’t want to say much without spoiling it, but if you enjoyed the first two seasons I can’t imagine not enjoying the third.

HR beat me to it, but I agree with him.

Sweet, good deal! Thanks, @admin & mikec, I'm stoked to check out Season 3 now (I guess once Wife & I wrap up on Strangers Things Season 1).

1. Better Call Saul 

Season 

3rd (10 episodes)

Network 

AMC 

Creators 

Vince Gilligan 

Peter Gould 

Cast 

Bob Odenkirk (Jimmy McGill)

Michael McKean (Charles McGill)

Jonathan Banks (Mike Ehrmantraut)

Rhea Seehorn (Kim Wexler) 

Patrick Fabian (Howard Hamlin)

Critical 

8.7/10 (IMDB)

97% (RT Critics)

95% (RT Audience)

Golden Globe Nominations 

- Best Performance by an Actor in a Drama (Odenkirk)

I don't know that I like Better Call Saul being in the first spot this season , I mean it was my least favorite season of the series so far. Not to say that it's bad show because it still made #5 on my personal list and it's a well made and brilliantly acted show but this season just had a lot of episodes and moments that left me checked out a little bit.

Having said that , it also had the greatest scene in the shows history with Chuck in the courtroom , that might of been the best scene in television all year. It kind of peaked there for me though and never really got me back in. I think part of the reason is I was never that big of a Saul Goodman fan , so when the show was focusing on Jimmy McGill I was in because Jimmy is a great character but the more and more Saul comes out the less engaged I become. I know I'm probably in the minority with that. And it feels wrong knocking it , I just don't think it was close to being the best show of the year. I do understand why others disagree though.

Michael McKean and Rhea Seehorn are both incredible though and it sucks they aren't getting the proper recognition for it. Banks as well but not as much this season.

That's the list! Thanks to everyone who sent a list and anyone who joined in on the discussion. I don't know I'll be doing a Best of the year Television countdown going forward as there is just too much content these days to narrow it down. It was an interesting experiment though.

The Show that missed the list:

The Leftovers
Twin Peaks
Master of None
Big Little Lies
Narcos
Vice Principals
Brockmire
Veep
Grace and Frankie
Legion
Orange is the New Black
The Vietnam War
The Good Place
The Walking Dead
The Americans
Mr. Robot
The Great British Bakeoff
The Blacklist
Girls
War Machine
Ozark
Brooklyn 99
Impractical Jokers
The Americans
Blindspot
Ray Donovan
American Gods
Fargo
Atypical
The 100
Timeless
Faceoff Season 11
Review
Halt and Catch Fire
Big Bang Theory
Faceoff Season 12
Scandal

Of that list , shows that I voted for were:

The Blacklist - One of the better network shows since the hey day of SVU , but this is probably even smarter. Good cast , absurd stories and great action.

Impractical Jokers - Surprised this didn't get a little more love than it did. I love Impractical Jokers and IMO it's the funniest thing on television.

The Walking Dead - The Season was the hardest to watch but it did get a hell of a lot better and had a great finale. And this season which also counts for 2017 started out great IMO.

Blindspot - An absurd show on NBC that is just too much craziness and fun to not watch it. It's my go to show when I got an hour to kill and just want to watch something absurd and fun.

Timeless - Like this show a lot - like the history aspect of it and think they had a really cool idea. It's not always executed greatly but the concept is interesting enough to keep me around.

Here was my Top 10. I can't believe I forgot about Better Call Saul.

1. The Handmaids Tale
2. Big Little Lies
3. The Deuce
4. Game of Thrones
5. Curb Your Enthusiasm
6. Stranger Things
7. The Americans
8. Ray Donovan
9. Fargo
10. The Good Place

Better Call Saul was tremendous with a finale that left me feeling all sorts of things I didn’t expect that show to be able to leave me with. It was my number four. What took me most by surprise from season 3 was that after two seasons of being interested in the Mike story as the highlight of the show, this season I was all in on Jimmy and didn’t worry too much about Mikes path.

I’m bummed that over half of my list didn’t make it. My list -

1 The Leftovers
2 The Deuce
3 Brockmire
4 Better Call Saul
5 The Good Place
6 Stranger Things 2
7 GLOW
8 Brooklyn 99
9 The Handmaids Tale
10 Review

So I’ll start from the bottom with my homerish pick of Review. It didn’t really belong on the list, there were only three episodes. But it was so consistently my favorite comedy on tv when it was on that I had to give it a parting nod for its amazing ending.

Brooklyn 99 has gotten more and more consistent and is as close to the Parks and Rec part of my heart that I miss on tv.

The Good Place ended season one with the most out of nowhere twist I’ve seen and then doubled the laughs in what has aired in season two.

Brockmire was a real marvel of crudeness on television but it was simply amazing. It had no boundaries for what the characters would say or do and somehow I was still moderately touched at times.

And The Leftovers was fucking amazing. If I made a list of my ten favorite episodes of television this year, Leftovers would have three of them at least. The buildup to Kevin going back to whatever he was going to was intense, then a lion sex boat, and then a simple, subtle finale that was able to settle in on the only story remaining that mattered. I don’t know how to talk about this show with people who haven’t seen it, but it’s been off the air for six months and I still am deciding what I think happened and didn’t happen and it’s wonderful. Anyway, deeply disappointed it didn’t make the list.

Just for fun my honorable mentions that were last cut off were Fargo, Legion, Game of Thrones, and Great News.