Apr 20, 2023 4:59:06 GMT X-zero said:

Apr 18, 2023 19:03:08 GMT c said:

LMAO...  Stokely vs Maxel at the compound gonna be hilarious.  I assume Wolfie will be getting involved too.  Goth baby will sit out, and likely Bartie as well, since he keeps getting banished from the streaming room.

Stokely is so criminally underused.

Find it crazy WWE released him.  Easily the one of the best managers.  

Apr 20, 2023 6:12:02 GMT c said:

Apr 20, 2023 4:59:06 GMT X-zero said:

Stokely is so criminally underused.

Find it crazy WWE released him.  Easily the one of the best managers.  

He wasn't released, he chose to leave.

I think it was the right decision. It wasn't like he was killing it in NXT and managers haven't really been a thing since '98. Of course there's exceptions like Heyman, but it's just that. Even MVP who is fantastic in the role doesn't receive the opportunities he should.

I'm not sure what to make of him in AEW. I want to like him, his social media game is strong but that Firm promo was awful and he just seems destined to be another Sonjay Dutt/Mark Sterling type. Perfectly fine lower-mid card manager, but never touching the main event scene.

Apr 20, 2023 7:55:41 GMT Big Pete said:

Apr 20, 2023 6:12:02 GMT c said:

Find it crazy WWE released him.  Easily the one of the best managers.  

He wasn't released, he chose to leave.

I think it was the right decision. It wasn't like he was killing it in NXT and managers haven't really been a thing since '98. Of course there's exceptions like Heyman, but it's just that. Even MVP who is fantastic in the role doesn't receive the opportunities he should.

I'm not sure what to make of him in AEW. I want to like him, his social media game is strong but that Firm promo was awful and he just seems destined to be another Sonjay Dutt/Mark Sterling type. Perfectly fine lower-mid card manager, but never touching the main event scene.

A manager can only do so much with projects like Curtis Axel and Omos may be too much. If the manager is new to the company don't give them lower card stables while they are establishing credibility. Indus Sher, Diamond Mine, and the Firm have done nothing for the man.

Apr 20, 2023 12:23:46 GMT X-zero said:

Apr 20, 2023 7:55:41 GMT Big Pete said:

He wasn't released, he chose to leave.

I think it was the right decision. It wasn't like he was killing it in NXT and managers haven't really been a thing since '98. Of course there's exceptions like Heyman, but it's just that. Even MVP who is fantastic in the role doesn't receive the opportunities he should.

I'm not sure what to make of him in AEW. I want to like him, his social media game is strong but that Firm promo was awful and he just seems destined to be another Sonjay Dutt/Mark Sterling type. Perfectly fine lower-mid card manager, but never touching the main event scene.

A manager can only do so much with projects like Curtis Axel and Omos may be too much. If the manager is new to the company don't give them lower card stables while they are establishing credibility. Indus Sher, Diamond Mine, and the Firm have done nothing for the man.

Even with Omos, MVP still comes across well. Whereas Stokely just comes off corny.

In that environment, there was no reason for the Firm segment to bomb like it did. It really was the Age of McGillicutty of promos.

Apr 20, 2023 12:23:46 GMT X-zero said:

Apr 20, 2023 7:55:41 GMT Big Pete said:

He wasn't released, he chose to leave.

I think it was the right decision. It wasn't like he was killing it in NXT and managers haven't really been a thing since '98. Of course there's exceptions like Heyman, but it's just that. Even MVP who is fantastic in the role doesn't receive the opportunities he should.

I'm not sure what to make of him in AEW. I want to like him, his social media game is strong but that Firm promo was awful and he just seems destined to be another Sonjay Dutt/Mark Sterling type. Perfectly fine lower-mid card manager, but never touching the main event scene.

A manager can only do so much with projects like Curtis Axel and Omos may be too much. If the manager is new to the company don't give them lower card stables while they are establishing credibility. Indus Sher, Diamond Mine, and the Firm have done nothing for the man.

Curtis Axel is awesome, Heyman may be good with acts like Roman Reigns and Brock Lesnar, but he couldn't handle the greatness of Axelmania.

I actually thought it was a pretty good show.

It's incredible to think how far Wardlow has fallen and only now getting some momentum after his angle with MJF all those months ago. Good on him.

The pillars - everyone except MJF needs promo classes. Jesus...

Jay White - are you fucking serious? This is Jay White and he's been inserted into a lower card feud with a bunch of jobbers. And, was that the real Komander? He looked 3 inches shorter, a shade paler and about 15lbs rounder than the guy in that ladder match. I don't get this style of work in 1v1 matches - all his opponents need to do is 'nope' and walk away and he'd crash and burn... Seriously take your time up there kid, we've got all night.

Jericho v Cole will be a riot. That was hands down the best thing Jericho has done in AEW. Too bad he'll suck the youth out of another young superstar and dispose of his body like every other person he's worked with in AEW.

Good main event but Jungle Boy needs a serious make over to ever be taken seriously.

Of course your favourite Jericho segment in AEW involves Adam Cole, nath.  :lol:

Ever since it was announced, Jay White vs. Komander has been on my mind. Not because I was necessarily looking forward to the match, but just how it felt like the most AEW match since Stadium Stampede. If you've only seen Komander through his AEW work, he's only wrestled two matches on the show. The first was a clustermuck of a ladder match where he got a couple of neat spots in. The other was against Sammy Guevara where he got completely out-classed.

In my mind, it would be like having Bret Hart vs. Juventud Guerrera on Nitro circa 1998. Or even Chris Benoit vs. Essa Rios on RAW as the Radicalz big debut match. It's an oddity to be sure and whle the business has changed a lot since then, I'm still not sure if that was the right presentation for White.

I was hoping with such a bold match they'd let the guys just put on a great match and get out of it. Of course I knew it would be too good to be true and the whole take-away from the segment would be Ricky Starks saving Komander from a beatdown. What I didn't expect was for Shawn Spears to take up the focus during the match doing a Kimberly Page gimmick. Unbelievable. That's AEW though, they rarely let anything breathe or establish a baseline. I don't know, I feel like we're back to the Miro hanging out with Kip Sabien days again.

The BCC/Elite brawl had it's moments. I thought Kenny was actually the MVP here and the hockey antics and the german on Yuta looked great. Holy smokes was Moxley bad in this though - dude really needs to take a vacation right now because he looks as sloppy and clumsy as ever. Good to see Takeshita  back in this, I'm sure we'll get Anarchy In The Arena II which worked well enough the first time.

When it comes to Darby, Perry, Guevara I'm reminded of Survivor Series 1992. Bret-Shawn were nowhere near ready for that match, but they needed to have it for their own good and needed that opportunity to improve to know what a main event position is like. It's never going to be smooth sailing and I thought Darby's promo in particular was his weakest in terms of delivery. I'm not convinced it'll be a 1-1 match at Double Or Nothing, Darby getting a bye was too much on the nose and made Darby seem like a punk for celebrating a free ride. I think Darby wins next week, Jungle Boy challenges Darby, Sammy ruins it and it ends in a huge kerfuffle where we get the four-way.

I'm honestly starting to think that Tony didn't think he was going to land Jay White. Then when he fell into his lap he was like "fuck we have to book him quick!"

They need to capitalize quickly though. Starks is a good first feud, but give them a bit of promo time to flesh out this feud. Print some damn Bullet Club Gold t-shirts already. Get another member to join them (I actually think that's where this is headed and Spears is going to join them...could see them pulling another fast one on Ricky Starks and challenging him to a trios match...Starks, Komander & Spears are in the ring, White & Juice enter, Spears turns and levels Starks with a chair, 3-on-2 beat down). Or at the very least bring in the rest of the BC guys that are stateside like El-P, KENTA, Chris Bey, etc.

Well Adam Cole is the coolest guy on the roster, outside of Jay White.

Quietly.. Adam Cole's mum

Shit, there's an idea. Instead of debuting and attacking "Absolutely Not" Ricky Starks and wrestling Spot Mon-komander he could have made his debut a few weeks down the line from now in the aftermath of that beatdown, evening the odds, forming Bullet Club Gold with Cole, Juice, Brit & Hyter and setting him up for an eventually program with Jericho.

I really liked Danielson's work as " the professional " and I think it would work even better if BCC just kayfabe refuse to wrestle until they get paid more - because they're professionals after all. Make light of all these guys sitting at home... etc.

Kenny Omega.. when Kenny Omega " gets angry " he dyes his hair black. Like a true teenage girl. Next week does he walk to the ring to The Black Parade?

Apr 20, 2023 7:55:41 GMT Big Pete said:

Apr 20, 2023 6:12:02 GMT c said:

Find it crazy WWE released him.  Easily the one of the best managers.  

He wasn't released, he chose to leave.

I think it was the right decision. It wasn't like he was killing it in NXT and managers haven't really been a thing since '98. Of course there's exceptions like Heyman, but it's just that. Even MVP who is fantastic in the role doesn't receive the opportunities he should.

I'm not sure what to make of him in AEW. I want to like him, his social media game is strong but that Firm promo was awful and he just seems destined to be another Sonjay Dutt/Mark Sterling type. Perfectly fine lower-mid card manager, but never touching the main event scene.

That makes more sense then.  Was curious why he was not wrestling in WWE.  Before WWE he did wrestle regularly.  And he was a good wrestler.  Had a hilarious feud with Chuck Taylor where he copyrighted the name Chuck Taylor and come out to his music as Chuck Taylor, while Chuck Taylor had random names and entrances.

I think he is limited by what he has to work with in AEW.  To see someone like him excel, you need to give him something to work with.  He is far more talented as a manager than Dutt or Sterling.  He is up there with old Prince Nana.  But he needs something to work with.  

Apr 20, 2023 21:19:05 GMT RT said:

I'm honestly starting to think that Tony didn't think he was going to land Jay White. Then when he fell into his lap he was like "fuck we have to book him quick!"

They need to capitalize quickly though. Starks is a good first feud, but give them a bit of promo time to flesh out this feud. Print some damn Bullet Club Gold t-shirts already. Get another member to join them (I actually think that's where this is headed and Spears is going to join them...could see them pulling another fast one on Ricky Starks and challenging him to a trios match...Starks, Komander & Spears are in the ring, White & Juice enter, Spears turns and levels Starks with a chair, 3-on-2 beat down). Or at the very least bring in the rest of the BC guys that are stateside like El-P, KENTA, Chris Bey, etc.

Everyone assumed White was locked into WWE.  The deal fell apart right at the end when the merge was announced.  It is very clear Tony was not ready for him.  That said, Juice and White are a killer team that I am sure will get going in time for Forbidden Door.  I assume they will get a third at some point too.  If they are willing to turn Cole, he would be the ideal choice as those three could be a killer combo.  Spears would be good if they want to keep Cole as a face.

In an odd ode to NXT, Spears is doing his " Perfect 10 " gimmick. Why? It was awful then... and worse now. He's actually better than that.

People seem to love the damn gimmick for some reason.

People love counting and chanting numbers and other simple noises. It's primitive. Nobody loves the gimmick, they just love repeating numbers. Just look what happens when someone climbs onto the second turnbuckle and punches someone in the corner.

I love this guy so much. He is too pure for wrestling.

The spot where Komander jumps between top and middle ropes is the new silliest thing I’ve seen in a wrestling ring.

With 11 new wrestlers debuting every month, I can't believe Spears is still around. I thought they would have got rid of him ages ago with the likes of Janela and Stunt.

How the hell is Swagger still there too?!

I hope Komander wrestles Samoa Joe next, and instead of hitting actual offensive moves, Joe just " nopes " and side steps every high spot until Komander is too sore to continue. Then Joe just rolls over Komander for the pin.

Apr 21, 2023 19:49:16 GMT @papaya said:

With 11 new wrestlers debuting every month, I can't believe Spears is still around. I thought they would have got rid of him ages ago with the likes of Janela and Stunt.

How the hell is Swagger still there too?!

You don't really expect Jericho to carry his own bags do you?

Jungle Boy - "I respect that Sammy Guevara puts his body, his life, his future on the line every time he steps in that ring." Umm, Darby Allin is the definition of putting everything on the line :lol: Why do you respect Sammy but not respect Darby?

Jungle Boy's promo was clearly the weakest. Darby and Sammy were both pretty good. Darby's delivery isn't great but he does find the right words to say.

What a dumb tournament structure. Three men, two matches, one gets a bye. Why not have three singles matches, like a mini round robin, and if they all win a match, have a triple threat? Or better yet, three MJF gauntlets where all three guys have to go through the same ten opponents of MJF's choosing. Whoever does the best in the gauntlet faces MJF.

-------------------

Why is Danielson not fighting? Is he hurt? He's right about Kenny. He's a professional in Japan, but elsewhere he's lazy and hangs out with a bunch of amateurs.

-------------------

My favourite part of Wardlow vs Hobbs is QT's Diamond Cutter. Silky smooth.

How many times have Wardlow and Hobbs traded the TNT belt?

-------------------

I can't believe it but I only rolled my eyes once during the Kommander vs Jay White match, and it was pretty early on. Most of Kommander's offense made complete sense in the match, and was spectacular at the same time. But he has a long way to go. Once Jay White got a hold of him, it was Blade Runner in an instant.

I don't exactly know how the Perfect Ten gimmick originated, I just know the silly hand gesture, but I love this idea of him trolling wrestlers by giving them low scores. Did he do that in NXT too?

-------------------

Speaking of trolling, that Chris Jericho promo was a lot of fun. I'm also enjoying Adam Cole as a babyface, at least his promos. Never cared for the guy in the ring.

That whole segment was brilliant. Luring Britt Baker and then having the Outcasts ambush her. Jericho said it himself with "never meet your idols" or whatever.

-------------------

MJF offered to help Sammy win the tournament, on the condition that Sammy lays down for MJF at Double or Nothing. Plus he gives Sammy a load of money. That sort of ruins the entire credibility of AEW. If the champion can just bribe people to lose to him. Match fixing. Very public match fixing.

And MJF views himself as a great wrestler, as he should, even if he cheats. Why, then, is he so afraid of defending his belt he needs people to lay down for him. "Because heel lol" is not an acceptable answer.

Who wrote that shit?

Emperor

IIRC after his loss to MJF he basically admitted that MJF was right that Bryan was putting wrestling above his children as he couldn’t move his arm to lift his children after their iron man match.

So I assume he is kayfabe resting after that.

Apr 20, 2023 21:19:05 GMT RT said:

I'm honestly starting to think that Tony didn't think he was going to land Jay White. Then when he fell into his lap he was like "fuck we have to book him quick!"

They need to capitalize quickly though. Starks is a good first feud, but give them a bit of promo time to flesh out this feud. Print some damn Bullet Club Gold t-shirts already. Get another member to join them (I actually think that's where this is headed and Spears is going to join them...could see them pulling another fast one on Ricky Starks and challenging him to a trios match...Starks, Komander & Spears are in the ring, White & Juice enter, Spears turns and levels Starks with a chair, 3-on-2 beat down). Or at the very least bring in the rest of the BC guys that are stateside like El-P, KENTA, Chris Bey, etc.

See, I was under the impression when they had Juice Robinson attack Ricky Starks on the Dynamite following Revolution they had plans in place for Jay White. Maybe those plans weren't concrete which is why they weren't going to involve White with the tippy top guys, but I don't think this was a last minute thing like Malakai Black originally was.

The impression I get watching the show is that it's booked around MJF, Jericho, Moxley and the Elite. So that means right now we have The Elite vs. The BCC because they needed an Anarchy In The Arena type match-up, so let's turn the BCC heel and prolong this Moxley-Page feud. Cole is back and they want to turn him babyface, so instead of him naturally factoring into The Elite stuff and developing his character there, let's put him with Jericho because he's the creative consultant of the company. MJF loves this pillars concept he came up with, so after wiping his hands of the BCC, let's go back to that and give these guys the opportunity.

So by the time they get to Jay White, there's not a whole lot on the board or any motivation for his character. I seriously think last week, they were pressed for time and since the card was lacking something they paired off Jay White vs. Komander and over-booked the hell out of the segment. Not only do we get the post-match beat-down/save that's become this serious crutch for the company but then you get Shawn Spears in there as well, with both Jay White & Komander trying to showcase themselves.

For mine throwing Spears into the mix is asking a lot of Jay White. Especially when he's already tied to Robinson who has really struggled to get over. I think if they expand it's important they give them somebody who is over or could get over with the right push like Archer.

Bullet Club needs more members and a purpose. BC always works best as a large group who just take over a fed. And this is not it right now. That said a bunch of people are lost in the shuffle now, and can really get revitalized in this group. I would love to see them up to 5 or so members, and pitted as a rival group to BCC. Also think Hobbs would be a great guy to be the BC enforcer. Dude is too good to risk getting lost in the shuffle again.

Still say too, with a large roster, factions are an amazing way to give people purpose, even when they are not wrestling.  Two factions feud suddenly any match between the two is a match with a story.  Tony should lean into this.  Top guys may not need stables, but everyone midcard or lower should be quick to align with others.

News came out today about the WWE hiring freeze and the long and short of it is that the company isn't hiring any new talent and apparently this has been a thing in place since January, and it came directly from corporate. WWE was really high on Jay White but apparently due to this freeze talks broke off and they couldn't make him an offer, so he signed with AEW. I think my hunch was right and everyone assumed White was WWE bound until they broke off contact and didn't offer him anything so he said fuck it and signed with AEW.

Apparently WWE was also planning on bringing in Nick Aldis but he signed with Impact because the same thing happened to him.

Explains the lack of preparation and lack of merch, but Big Pete's theory makes sense too. Every big debut in AEW so far has gone through one of Jon Moxley, Chris Jericho or The Elite, and with all of them busy in other feuds they had to throw Jay White in there somewhere.

I assume this is all leading to Jay White vs Ricky Starks at DON which is fine by me. Starks should be in that upper-mid-card area and both guys are more than capable of making a random thrown together feud work, and the match should be good. I just hope the fact that we legit have a Bullet Club faction in AEW after all these years doesn't get wasted. Time will tell.

I assume G.O.D. is coming to join the Bullet Club in the near future. They were on the WWE list as well. And really, G.O.D. is just a great trios that AEW could really use anyway. Would fill out BC nicely too.  Great team to exchange back to NJPW to use their talent at other shows.

G.O.D. ain't joining Bullet Club.

To cut a long story short, in the pandemic era Jay betrayed G.O.D. kicking them out of Bullet Club while they were all in Impact. Tama and Jay feuded for a while. Their brother Hikuleo stayed with Bullet Club for a while but eventually turned on Jay, not too dissimilar to how Sami Zayn turned on Roman. Hikuleo then beat Jay in a loser leaves Japan match.

If they show up in AEW, it ain't to be buddies with Jay White.

Or Jay just cuts a promo saying he knows how tough these men are because he fought them all himself at one point. Easily fixed. Maybe will not fly in Japan, but with Tony's booking, he could make it fly here since most US fans claim to love Bullet Club, but have no idea who is even Bullet Club at any given time.

Apr 24, 2023 18:28:37 GMT c said:

Or Jay just cuts a promo saying he knows how tough these men are because he fought them all himself at one point. Easily fixed. Maybe will not fly in Japan, but with Tony's booking, he could make it fly here since most US fans claim to love Bullet Club, but have no idea who is even Bullet Club at any given time.

Tony deciding to spit in the face of almost a year-long storyline in NJPW would be one of the dumbest booking decisions ever made. Why would he do any of this? Who needs GOD in Bullet Club that badly?

I’m not trying to be a dick, I like to fantasy book as much as the next person, I just don’t get it.

There are already options state side that could appear whenever available. Clark Connors is known to the AEW crowd and just joined their ranks. Ace Austin & Chris Bey are right there. Also KENTA has already popped up in AEW more than once and is the current Strong Champion. Bring those guys in if you need numbers for something.

Have BC Gold adopt the USA branch of Bullet Club under the U S of Jay! Weeeeee

The trouble is David Finlay officially outed Jay White with a shillelagh shot to the head, so it's going to be hard to reconcile Finlay's Bullet Club guys joining with Jay White. But to be fair it wasn't all of Bullet Club usurping the old leader as per previous leaders, it was literally only Finlay, so you could book KENTA et al. to still be cool with Jay.

My feeling is that they will keep NJPW Bullet Club and USA Bullet Club separate.

Apr 24, 2023 20:34:49 GMT Emperor said:

The trouble is David Finlay officially outed Jay White with a shillelagh shot to the head, so it's going to be hard to reconcile Finlay's Bullet Club guys joining with Jay White. But to be fair it wasn't all of Bullet Club usurping the old leader as per previous leaders, it was literally only Finlay, so you could book KENTA et al. to still be cool with Jay.

My feeling is that they will keep NJPW Bullet Club and USA Bullet Club separate.

This is what I'm expecting too. If there's ever a callback to Finlay becoming leader and ousting Jay White, it will probably happen at an NJPW show. The only other people appearing alongside Jay White should be the ones I listed.

I always though it would be cool for Bullet Club to have both a Japan branch and a USA branch and it looks like it's kinda sorta finally happening.