Apr 30, 2018 3:56:41 GMT theend said:

Emasculating men by calling them pussies seems oddly regressive.

Sorry if you feel triggered.

Apr 30, 2018 3:29:20 GMT Kilgore said:

All the conservative tears about the Correspondence dinner should be the final nail in the coffin that only liberals are easily offended. What a bunch of babies.

That one example compared to a dozen I can find relating to liberals.  

There are dozens on both sides.

Great video on the Apu situation.

Apr 30, 2018 17:31:14 GMT mikec said:

There are dozens on both sides.

All you have to do is look at the nonsense going on in college campuses across the nation to see what I speak of.   That's a more serious problem than a few conservatives crying about a roast.  

Apr 30, 2018 17:43:11 GMT thereallt said:

Apr 30, 2018 17:31:14 GMT mikec said:

There are dozens on both sides.

All you have to do is look at the nonsense going on in college campuses across the nation to see what I speak of.

I know what you speak of and didn’t deny that there are people that are easily offended on my side. I just think the side that tried to ban sex toys in Texas, that went overboard bitching about Katy Perry kissing a boy on American Idol, and that is going crazy over a roast has its own share of people that get offended over stupid shit.

Apr 30, 2018 17:46:52 GMT mikec said:

Apr 30, 2018 17:43:11 GMT thereallt said:

All you have to do is look at the nonsense going on in college campuses across the nation to see what I speak of.

I know what you speak of and didn’t deny that there are people that are easily offended on my side. I just think the side that tried to ban sex toys in Texas, that went overboard bitching about Katy Perry kissing a boy on American Idol, and that is going crazy over a roast has its own share of people that get offended over stupid shit.

To be fair, if Katy Perry was, say, Justin Timberlake and did that to a young girl, it'd be a focal point of the #metoo movement. What she did was not okay, good humored or not.

The funny thing about this whole Michelle Wolf situation is that most of her jokes were low-hanging fruit. It wasn't like she said anything that hasn't been repeated ad-nauseum on any of those political comedy shows and every one who was there was fair game. I could be wrong, but the biggest complaint seems to be about Huckabee Sanders' make-up. While the joke didn't quite land, she wasn't calling her ugly or whatever she was being called on and any suggestion that woman shouldn't make fun of another woman is ridiculous.

Katy Perry and American Idol staging a sexual assault for ratings is a bit different than taking offense to speech.   that one is a bit of a reach.  Not sure why one would reach for that one.  It's a bit off base.

getting offended to the point of shouting down dissenting voices or trying to limit speech is a bit of a problem. Or trying to change laws or not enforcing laws when it suits a fancy.

the old religious right used to get bothered about everything.  they kind of invented creating laws and reforms to limit the general offensive nature of things.  Now the left has taken over.  The torch has been passed.  Just look at who used to oppress comedians and who does now and the techniques used.

Apr 30, 2018 18:10:25 GMT KJ said:

Apr 30, 2018 17:46:52 GMT mikec said:

I know what you speak of and didn’t deny that there are people that are easily offended on my side. I just think the side that tried to ban sex toys in Texas, that went overboard bitching about Katy Perry kissing a boy on American Idol, and that is going crazy over a roast has its own share of people that get offended over stupid shit.

To be fair, if Katy Perry was, say, Justin Timberlake and did that to a young girl, it'd be a focal point of the #metoo movement. What she did was not okay, good humored or not.

And if it had been a country music Americana sweetheart instead of Katy Perry that did it nobody would have noticed. And use of the phrase sexual assault as above about it only magnifies the overreach.

I’m not saying it’s okay or even good, and I can’t necessarily deny that it’s be different if the genders were reversed, (but I can spend some time on the empirical reasons it’d be different if the genders were reversed.) I’m saying it’s not worth the attention it got and every time we position it as sexual assault we diminish sexual assault.

"Sexual assault is an act in which a person sexually touches another person without that person's consent, or coerces or physically forces a person to engage in a sexual act against their will."- yep. big overreach.

He said no. She persisted. She tricked him. Look at his physical reaction after.   Such a great feminist she is.



He said it made him uncomfortable.  He spoke to his family afterward about how he was confused about he felt about it.


A physical act vs a joke. She me on the doll where the joke hurt you. Well, show me on the doll where the singer touched you. Welp, that's a difference. Physical touch vs words.

Reminds me of Kesha trying to hug Seinfeld.

I still think it’s stretching too hard to make something big out of something tiny. And I think it’s been made this big primarily by men who are bothered by the me too movement and want to make it look this petty when the better part of it isn’t.

Apr 30, 2018 20:49:32 GMT mikec said:

I still think it’s stretching too hard to make something big out of something tiny. And I think it’s been made this big primarily by men who are bothered by the me too movement and want to make it look this petty when the better part of it isn’t.

I would in no means disagree with this accounts for some people.  I would also say there is just some selective outrage over some feminist commentary in general.
Selective outrage is an odd thing.  I think it affects people universally.  

Listening to the Correspondent Dinner Roast right now. I honestly don't see what the big deal is. She went after both sides of the political isle, she just saved her most brutal jokes for Trump and his staff. The problem for me was that she simply isn't funny, just annoying.

Apr 30, 2018 17:43:11 GMT thereallt said:

Apr 30, 2018 17:31:14 GMT mikec said:

There are dozens on both sides.

All you have to do is look at the nonsense going on in college campuses across the nation to see what I speak of.   That's a more serious problem than a few conservatives crying about a roast.  

I couldn't disagree with you any more about this. College kids crying about safe spaces is not close to a problem. They're entitled silly cunts, no doubt, but they wield no power whatsoever. They're young nobodies whom will soon be in debt for tens (or hundreds) of thousands of dollars and about to enter a shrinking workforce that will never be able to justify the degree they've just spent all this money on. They're not going to be affecting policies of anything in the near future. 

The press and the politicians, on the other hand, are affecting policies all the time. This current example of their crying about a comedian saying mean things to obfuscate from the facts that everything she said happened to be true is far more of a real problem, and unfortunately a perfect microcosm of political discourse today. Making a national conversation about whether one can make fun of Sarah Huckabee Sanders' eye shadow when the bulk of the jokes and criticism about her was her blatant lying on behalf of a fairly objectively terrible administration is what the news has devolved into. Right partisans love to bring up "college campuses" because it's an easy target with very low stakes and it distracts from far more egregious offenses by people in actual positions of power (like their fellow press members and politicians they do propaganda for). They get people all fired up about the "crazy left killing free speech on college campuses," which isn't a free speech issue at all (they're mostly private institutions that can legally look as ridiculous as they want), while the people they prop up literally kill free speech by writing laws that prohibit businesses from practicing BDS in 17(!) states, for one ridiculous example. Businesses practicing a specific boycott, illegal in 17 states. 

Conservatives just cry about different things. Colin Kaepernick, Hamilton, desecration of the American flag, every "libtard comedian" who does even a mild criticism of Trump, but they're just as whiny as any overweight green haired chick on a college campus. All the conservative pundits on Twitter are hilarious. They'll make fun of whatever liberals are boycotting last week, and then unironically call for a boycott of SNL, or some sneakers, or some shit the very next week. "How dare the libs try and get Bill O'Reilly off the air! Let's get Jake Tapper off the air!" It's irony on the most basic level. 

Apr 30, 2018 20:07:30 GMT mikec said:

Apr 30, 2018 18:10:25 GMT KJ said:

To be fair, if Katy Perry was, say, Justin Timberlake and did that to a young girl, it'd be a focal point of the #metoo movement. What she did was not okay, good humored or not.

And if it had been a country music Americana sweetheart instead of Katy Perry that did it nobody would have noticed. And use of the phrase sexual assault as above about it only magnifies the overreach.

I’m not saying it’s okay or even good, and I can’t necessarily deny that it’s be different if the genders were reversed, (but I can spend some time on the empirical reasons it’d be different if the genders were reversed.) I’m saying it’s not worth the attention it got and every time we position it as sexual assault we diminish sexual assault.

1) I’d love to hear the empirical data why it’d be different if genders were switched.

2) I don’t care who did it - country sweetheart or Perry - but it was absolutely terrible. Harmless isn’t for us to decide: the kid said no and was ignored. That’s wrong, regardless of gender, person, etc. Its a quintessential example of non-consent. That SHOULD matter.

I couldn't disagree with you any more about this. College kids crying about safe spaces is not close to a problem. They're entitled silly cunts, no doubt, but they wield no power whatsoever. They're young nobodies whom will soon be in debt for tens (or hundreds) of thousands of dollars and about to enter a shrinking workforce that will never be able to justify the degree they've just spent all this money on. They're not going to be affecting policies of anything in the near future.

Keep in mind the policies ENABLING these kids were put in place by the far left of Generation X (my generation sadly) who are now IN CHARGE of those campuses. And those policies are a big reason why said kids WILL NOT amount to anything. Sorry but that is pretty damaging in my book.

And for all the bloviating the far right does, VERY little actual censorship or harm has come about.   Meanwhile in college campuses censorship and suppression are par for the course.

May 1, 2018 0:40:25 GMT KJ said:

Apr 30, 2018 20:07:30 GMT mikec said:

And if it had been a country music Americana sweetheart instead of Katy Perry that did it nobody would have noticed. And use of the phrase sexual assault as above about it only magnifies the overreach.

I’m not saying it’s okay or even good, and I can’t necessarily deny that it’s be different if the genders were reversed, (but I can spend some time on the empirical reasons it’d be different if the genders were reversed.) I’m saying it’s not worth the attention it got and every time we position it as sexual assault we diminish sexual assault.

1) I’d love to hear the empirical data why it’d be different if genders were switched.

2) I don’t care who did it - country sweetheart or Perry - but it was absolutely terrible. Harmless isn’t for us to decide: the kid said no and was ignored. That’s wrong, regardless of gender, person, etc. Its a quintessential example of non-consent. That SHOULD matter.

That there is no #metoo men’s movement is the empirical reason it isn’t the same. There’s a world of power structure built up by decades/centuries/millennia(?) of men using power or status to take advantage of women, to force them to do things they didn’t want to do, and to threaten physical harm when they didn’t do those things. The event doesn’t happen in a vacuum where none of that baggage exists. There’s a reason that people have to say “if a man did that!” as part of the point, because no one had even a subliminal thought of that person being in a dangerous position or about all the men ruined by a woman that demanded sexual favors for advancement.

I have seen the edited clip a few times but don’t watch the show. Did the kid say no or did he say later that he would have said no? Not that there’s a difference, just that’s two people saying he said no when I don’t believe the clips above don’t have him doing that (I watched them at work so I couldn’t study, just know the reporters said he would have said no which implies he didn’t).

I’m not saying it’s ok. I’m also saying that the outrage I’ve seen expressed over it rings false and silly and comes from people who would think it was cute if the politics were reversed.

Umm but there is the hashtag #mentoo. Just not as trendy.

May 1, 2018 1:59:19 GMT theend said:

Umm but there is the hashtag #mentoo. Just not as trendy.

Yeah so untrendy it’s not really a thing. (And not to be all “I get to judge that”, but this is coming from a young male victim of female sexual abuse. There aren’t a lot of us, even counting the 14 year olds banging their teachers)

I did look up mentoo just for the humor. One of the first tweets I read cites a “gynocracy” lol

Unfortunately Mike there are more of you than you care to imagine. But the patriarchal type systems you speak that quiet women quiet men too. Heck, in the US it is likely men are more often raped than women.
L
It's odd to almost to dismiss teachers raping boys.  I guess the patriarchy got to you as you see it as the boys doing the fucking.  The numbers continue to rise of women teachers raping young boys as they often escape punishment.

There was a study of boys in corrections facilities that showed overwhelming numbers of women taking advantage of boys.

But the system gives no voice to male victims. No shelters. No crisis lines. Just shut up, you liked it, show no emotions and hide it.

May 1, 2018 2:32:18 GMT theend said:

Unfortunately Mike there are more of you than you care to imagine. But the patriarchal type systems you speak that quiet women quiet men too. Heck, in the US it is likely men are more often raped than women.
L
It's odd to almost to dismiss teachers raping boys.  I guess the patriarchy got to you as you see it as the boys doing the fucking.  The numbers continue to rise of women teachers raping young boys as they often escape punishment.

There was a study of boys in corrections facilities that showed overwhelming numbers of women taking advantage of boys.

But the system gives no voice to male victims. No shelters. No crisis lines. Just shut up, you liked it, show no emotions and hide it.

Meh, I’d like to see a study that suggests more men are raped than women, and moreover for this specific discussion that more men are raped by women than women are raped by men. Many male survivors of abuse are abused by men.

I was flippant about teenage boys and their teachers unnecessarily. I’m sure some of those relationships are truly abusive and harmful to the young men and all of them are wrong.

I get it you were also the guy who was quick to dismiss the sexual assault by Katy perry.

I’d like to see a study that suggests more men are raped than women

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/cifamerica/2012/feb/21/us-more-men-raped-than-women

moreover for this specific discussion that more men are raped by women than women are raped by men.

not sure I or anyone made that claim but here you go, probably the closest you will find.

www.slate.com/articles/double_x/doublex/2014/04/male_rape_in_america_a_new_study_reveals_that_men_are_sexually_assaulted.html

Here is how it is literally legally being oppressed systematically as not being called rape.
theconversation.com/men-forced-to-have-sex-with-women-arent-being-properly-recognised-by-the-law-legal-expert-81638

Here is what I referenced about the women in corrections raping boys.

www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/svjfry09.pdf

Here is a study with a dramatic number

squawker.org/culture-wars/ucla-shock-study-women-have-raped-3-6-million-american-men/

When you really think of it, MRA's and incels and all that jazz were likely sexually molested at one point.

Then again you'll likely act as apologist and just pick apart any and all studies that don't fit.  Oh well.  Free information to do with as you please.  Men are the victims of men too.  And also the victims of women.  We are all victims. And we are all scrum.

I am the guy that is quick to dismiss the Katy Perry situation. Nothing anyone has said has convinced me that the outrage over it was real or necessary.

The first article you posted is disputing the idea that men are raped more often than women by presenting arguments for why the numbers in a study aren’t a great source.

As to why I commented about it being a men raped by women issue, this all spins out of a conversation about Katy Perry, a woman, “sexually assaulting” a man and the history of men oppressing women through sexual assault and a lack of the same history going the other way. Male on male prison rape has no real spot in that conversation.

The Slate article disputes The Converaation article claim that rape is gender biased anymore in the US, as the definition by the FBI was changed in 2012.

But anyway, that was mostly irrelevant to all of the thread and the argument I was making and I don’t feel like answering for every woman that’s forced a man to have sex because Katy Perry once kissed a boy on tv and a bunch of men got pissed that the optics aren’t the same.

Unfortunately Mike there are more of you than you care to imagine. But the patriarchal type systems you speak that quiet women quiet men too. Heck, in the US it is likely men are more often raped than women.

This is only true regarding men and women that have been incarcerated.

I think that men are far more aggressive than women and we don't have much to complain about when it comes to physical attacks.
Men are more vulnerable when it comes to areas such as custody disputes and divorce, this is the major power imbalance that men face

I do wish people would stop doing the nudge nudge wink wink about the male student "raped" by their teacher.
Yeah the boy probably wanted it and all the high five's that came with it, but let's see if he is able to form normal relationships in the future, this is a sad outcome of power imbalance relationships.
I had a male friend who was groomed and I to me it seems it has messed him up completely emotionally... Not that we talk about our feelings

I am pretty sure nothing would sway you.

"For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who don't believe, no proof is possible." - Stuart Chase

The highlight I always take from that one report is

• Approximately 95% of all youth reporting staff sexual misconduct
said they had been victimized by female staff. In 2008,
42% of staff in state juvenile facilities were female.

Here is some more history

In cases of daycare molestation, more than 60% of children who were molested, were molested by women.
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10766112

Not much of a gap here

data indicate that 57.2 percent of all students report a male
offender and 42.4 percent a female offender

www2.ed.gov/rschstat/research/pubs/misconductreview/report.pdf

And if I remember right Mike is an Ohio boy. Or is Iowa? I know if one of the midwest states. The FBI may have changed their definition but Ohio hasn't

ocjs.ohio.gov/crime_definitions.stm

FORCIBLE RAPE = The carnal knowledge of a female forcibly and against her will. Assaults or attempts to commit rape by force are included here; however, statutory rape (without force) and other sex offenses are not included.

So in Ohio boys and men can't be raped.


But back on the original subject. Is retard universally considered offensive? I find it seems most people seem to now get offended by that and the use of racial slurs and such.

I gave you reasons your proof wasn’t really swaying me in the conversation. I think this is as much a case of the first part of that quote where you want to believe something at least as much as me being hard to convince.

But no kidding, most daycare sex offenses are committed by women. Considering that most daycare providers are also women, it seems like that wouldn’t be a surprise. The link you posted didn’t lead me to that article though, it lead me to an abstract that says that most cases of molestation are girls being molested by men.

And the PPSS study shared four or five different studies of the sex of the offender and several of the studies found that >80% of offenders were male in schools.

As for retard, yeah I’d guess that it’s been almost universally condemned at this point.

On the original subject, I find it interesting that many people who claim not to be easily offended or say just being offended is no big deal turn the page real quick when it comes to racial humor with intent or the developmentally disabled. Not too long ago that would have been fair game. Now, nope.

Not saying they should be game. But it is an evolution.


The term eye-talian seems to offend many.

Could anyone imagine this being released today?


There would be so many panty-waisted complaints it wouldn't be funny.