There’s no denying the fact that Evolution was a great stable. I placed them at a pretty decent spot. They made Orton and Batista bigger names and for that alone, the faction is a big deal.

However, watching it live I fucking hated them. I didn’t even care for Batistas face turn, although I get how cool it was. I liked Orton and that was pretty much it during the “live” run. Now that it’s over, I have to give them props for what they accomplished.

I had Evolution way up at #5 for being the definitive stable of the 2000s.

From a fan standpoint, I started out as an Evolution disliker. Trips was at his worst when the group formed. I didn't like Flair as a heel splitting his time between wrestling and managing. By this point Flair was always going to be cheered by a sizable portion of the audience. It felt counter productive to force him into a heel role. Plus I thought he still had a lot to give as a full time wrestler. Orton was boring (aside from the short-lived RNN segments) and over pushed. While Batista was just generic hoss #11....a Bull Buchanan lacking even the athleticism of RTC's resident hoss.

But they grew on me enough to become an Evolution respecter (I never did LOVE them) during their Dangerous Alliancesque 2004 run where they were having great lengthy tag matches on Raw every week against a quality collection of babyfaces including Michaels, Benoit, Foley, Shelton, Jericho, Edge, and even Tajiri. I started coming back around on Trips when he had that awesome Raw match with Michaels at the end of 2003 and was fully back to being a HHH fan when he did the right thing by dropping the belt to Benoit at 'Mania. It managed to keep Flair relevant. The awesome Foley feud at least got me to hate Orton in the good way, meaning I cared. Batista became their surprising breakout star as a badass hoss. I had a lapsed fan friend during this period who still didn't like then-current wrestling. "This guy was boring. That guy sucked. Where have all the characters gone?" But he LOVED Batista. It was amusing. I also had a girl friend who was enamored with Batista because he was "hot." Fwiw Batista grew on me too. 

Evolution was very much a HHH/WWE version of the Horsemen* and it worked. They had a great theme, looked & carried themselves like stars, and worked as a cohesive unit. It kept HHH on top, gave Flair something to do in his twilight years, and most importantly created two huge stars in Orton & Batista.

*From about 98-02 I was obsessed with a WWF version of the Horsemen. I'd fantasy book the hell out of my (probably terrible) various WWF versions of the Horsemen. This all stopped once Evolution became a thing. Meaning I saw them as nothing less than WWF's version of the iconic NWA/WCW stable.

The Orton babyface turn flopped but they made up for it with Batista's big babyface turn, which is one of the more memorable storylines of that entire decade. Plus Orton eventually recovered anyway. Despite not being a huge Evolution fan in their prime, I marked out for them that time I went to a Raw show in 2014. They were feuding with The Shield at the time. 
---------------------------------
I'm curious to see who the Top 6 will be. I can't for the life of me think of the 6th. Horsemen, NWO, DX, Hart Foundation, and Shield are locks. Then who? Ministry? Freebirds? Wolfpack?? CAMP CORNETTE! Nah. None of those feel right. Who am I forgetting? Any thoughts?

I had Evolution at 13, I have softened on them over the years. Batista and Orton were made into big deals and that thumbs down moment from Triple H was pretty cool. Most of the time though I was just groaning at Triple H's obsession with trying to duplicate Ric Flair's career.

Count me in with everyone who understood but nevertheless disliked Evolution in real time, but then grew to respect and even outright love them over time.

The start-stop beginning due to Orton and Batista injuries didn't help my impression of them in real time. When did they actually start a full run together as a complete foursome? Late 2003? I think they maybe had a blip in early 2003, but then injuries...

I think a complete run would've helped cement them more easily and a lot quicker for me in real time. Assuming they can all stay healthy, maybe establish them by doing that Legacy gimmick in the 2003 Royal Rumble by having them selflessly help HHH win (keeping HBK and HHH apart, with HHH going on to have his first one on one rematch with HBK take place at WMXIX).

I also love how Taker ended up beating each member of Evolution at Mania like some sort of pro wrestling version of the Christmas Carol... defeating HHH of the present, then Flair of the past, then Orton of the future, then Batista of the present, then HHH of the past. Trippy shit.

I liked Evolution so much better when they were called "The Four Horseman"

That being said, they still ranked #8 on my list. If you're going to steal, you might as well steal from the best.

May 30, 2019 18:33:01 GMT UT said:

The concept of Evolution itself was brilliant and worked as well, sadly I think the concept has become overplayed and overused by every fantasy booker/stable maker since thinking that every single faction needs a legend , a current stud and future studs and it gets a little annoying.

I'm probably overlooking something but I can't think of any examples of Evolution rip offs. Can you name some?

Had a cool theme song!

May 30, 2019 21:13:31 GMT Emperor said:

May 30, 2019 18:33:01 GMT UT said:

The concept of Evolution itself was brilliant and worked as well, sadly I think the concept has become overplayed and overused by every fantasy booker/stable maker since thinking that every single faction needs a legend , a current stud and future studs and it gets a little annoying.

I'm probably overlooking something but I can't think of any examples of Evolution rip offs. Can you name some?

FOURtune (or however they spelled it) in TNA but they had more members. I think UT was referring to people who do fantasy booking though.

May 30, 2019 21:20:05 GMT Shootist said:

May 30, 2019 21:13:31 GMT Emperor said:

I'm probably overlooking something but I can't think of any examples of Evolution rip offs. Can you name some?

FOURtune (or however they spelled it) in TNA but they had more members. I think UT was referring to people who do fantasy booking though.

Yeah next to black/British wrestlers I think everyone wanted to book the next evolution.

Evolution is like that big budget Hollywood movie that was supposed to wind up as a franchise but instead it barely made back it's budget. Not a total disaster, but considering all the resources it had poured into it, it should have been THE biggest faction of all-time and instead it wouldn't make most people's Top 5. I think the WWE have tried their best to pretend Evolution was a lot bigger than it was with the deal at Wrestlemania 30 and Wrestlemania 35, but even those fell comfortably flat.

STILL, even though it fell comfortably short of where it should have ended up, ultimately it did serve a point in advancing HHH's character while making a star out of Batista. In hindsight, the stable wasn't too bad, it's just difficult to wipe the taste of overly long segments that dragged the entire product down.

As far as Evolution clones, there was a period in 2004 where the WWE had their other two top heels shamelessly rip off HHH's idea so you had JBL's Cabinent and Team Angle Redux. Both had a similar formation where they'd pair the top heel with an up and comer (Orlando Jordan and Mark Jindrak) and hosses (The Bashams and Luther Reigns) and they were doing hokey 80s rasslin angles.

Every now and then you'd see something similar crop up. Legacy for instance was clearly a rip-off in Orton's vision and they absolutely sucked. Not because they were bad, but because the whole stable was built to appear like bumbling fools.

6. The Fabulous Freebirds 

Active 

1979 - 1994 

Members 

Michael "PS" Hayes 

Terry Gordy 

Buddy Roberts 

Jimmy Garvin 

Notable Feuds 

The Von Erichs 

The Midnight Express 

Road Warriors 

Notable Matches 

The Freebirds vs The Road Warriors (WCW Power Hour , 1989)

The Freebirds vs The Midnight Express (NWA World Title Match , June 1989)

Ric Flair vs Kerry Von Erich (Decembers 25th , 1982)

The Freebirds vs The Von Erichs (Anything Goes Match , July 4th, 1984)

Championships and Accolades 

- 3x NWA National Tag Team Champions 

- 1x NWA Georgia Tag Team Champions 

- 2x Mid-South Tag Team Champions 

- 1x UWF Heavyweight Champion (Gordy)

- 1x UWF Television Champion (Roberts)

- 1x NWA United States Champion (Hayes)

- 1x NWA World Tag Team Champions 

- 2x WCW United States Tag Team Champions 

- 1x WCW Six Man Tag Champions

- 1x WCW World Tag Team Champions 

- 1x NWA American Heavyweight Champion 

- 1x NWA American Tag Team Champions 

- 6x WCCW Six Man Tag Team Champions 

- 2016 WWE Hall of Fame Inductees

- 2005 WON Hall of Fame Inductees 

- 1980 WON Tag Team of the Year 

- 1983 WON Feud of the Year (vs Von Erichs)

- 1984 WON Feud of the Year (vs Von Erichs)

- 1984 WON Match of the Year (vs Von Erichs) 

- 1981 PWI Tag Team of the Year 

The Freebirds were #9 on my list. Definitely one of the defining factions when I was growing up, but I was never the biggest fan. But I still had to rank them out of sheer respect. They helped produce some absolutely legendary matches and feuds.

I've been trying to catch up on as much Freebirds/Von Erichs as I can in the past few months , I still need to do a lot more and often get sidetracked down a different wrestling rabbit hole but the stuff I have seen is pretty fucking classic and does a good job of living up to the lore and reverence it's often spoken about. Still arguably the greatest feud of all time when you consider the animosity of the fans towards the freebirds and just HOW much that feud meant to them on a personal level down in Texas. I don't know that there has ever been anything like it.

#6 is probably a fair spot for them considering they might just be the first faction of wrestling. They had everything you'll ever need in all three original members with the talker (Hayes) , the powerhouse (Gordy) and the worker (Roberts). They still have a fucking rule named after and for them and a rule that most fans still want to see around today when some of the three man factions have shown up.

Last but certainly not least , if you like the Freebirds and like the cut of their jib - don't forget to come check them out in my fantasy draft card (coming soon) and show some Freebird love!

They were before my time and I only voted for my favourite factions so the Freebirds didn't even cross my mind.

Wow. I didn't expect the Freebirds to be so high (above Evolution!) given the age and WWE-centric nature of our posters. Not that I'm necessarily complaining since I had the 'Birds at a very respectable #9 on my own list.

I've told the story before of how the Freebirds had go away heat with me as a kid. I thought they were terrible. Seeing them praised as legends by the Apter Mags and the late 90s internet was always a mind screw, while Terry Gordy getting a Hulk Hogan level reaction at The ECW Arena might just be the biggest mind screw in my 32 years of wrestling fandom. I didn't get it...

And that was entirely on me. Dismissing the Freebirds because of their crappy WCW run(s) would be like dismissing the NWO based entirely on their lousy 2002 WWE run.

It wasn't until I got into 80s territorial wrestling in the early 2000s that I learned to appreciate the greatness of the Freebirds. They're often considered the first high profile stable, predating the Horsemen by a few years. They were kind of like The Shield if The Shield jumped from promotion to promotion, popping the territory wherever they went.

Michael Hayes was great as a shit stirring wrestler/manager in the Roddy Piper/Eddie Gilbert mold. PS was great on the mic, had tons of charisma, and is my personal favorite 'Bird. Gordy was a 280 pound ass kicking machine. I recommend his hoss fights with Dr. Death in UWF. That has to be among JR's favorite matches/feuds of all time. As for Buddy Roberts.....well, 2 out of 3 ain't bad. Somebody had to do the jobs. And I suppose he was serviceable enough as an X-Pac style tagalong kid whose ass you wanted to see kicked.

The Freebirds are best remembered today for their legendary feud in World Class with the Von Erichs. They wrestled in front of some of the hottest crowds in pro wrestling history. The Birds/Von Erichs July 4th "Come As You Are" street fight has my highest recommendation. That was my working #1 for the proposed 6 Man Tag Countdown a while back. I don't understand why it hasn't been entered into the canon of Great 80s Brawls. It was like a street fight between two rival gangs.

But the truth is I haven't seen a ton of the Birds World Class run. Where they won me over was in 86-87 Watts UWF. They were all over tv as the lead heels, often coming out multiple times per show. For much of that time Gordy was the champ, Hayes did triple duty as a manager, wrestler, and Heenanesque color commentator, while Buddy was the TV champ. They feuded with all the top babyfaces while still finding the time to put out the occasional music video. Great stuff. Also bonus points for their fabulous taste in entrance music.

Seconding Bakers rec of the Come As You Are street fight. Great match. Y’all should check it out for a quick snippet of the Birds and Von Erich’s.

It also won the WON MOTY that year.

I didn't have the Freebirds on my list.

May 31, 2019 20:04:57 GMT KING KID said:

I didn't have the Freebirds on my list.

Me neither.

And I love Lynyrd Skynyrd.

But I think Demolition Rule has a cooler ring to it than Freebird Rule.

#WWFloyalist4life

I had the Freebirds at number 3. They set so many precedents when it came to factions and wrestling in general that putting the copycats ahead of them seemed wrong. Entrance music, the Freebird Rule, the structure of the group laid the foundation for what was to come. They also had staying power and were big players nearly everywhere they went except for the WWF where the hightailed it out of there within maybe a month.

All that being said they rank right up there for my most hated of the 80's. But I guess that means they were doing their job.

Terry Gordy rules though, Hayes got the majority of the heat.

5. The Shield 

Years Active 

2012 - 2014 

2017 

2018 

2019 

Members 

Seth Rollins 

Dean Ambrose 

Roman Reigns 

Notable Feuds 

The Wyatt Family 

Evolution 

Goldust & Cody Rhodes 

Team Hell No 

Ryback 

Notable Matches 

The Shield vs Evolution (Extreme Rules 2014)

The Shield vs The Wyatt Family (Elimination Chamber 2014)

The Shield vs Cody Rhodes & Goldust (Battleground 2013)

The Shield vs Evolution (Payback 2014)

The Shield vs Team Hell No & Ryback (TLC 2012)

The Shield were my #1 with a bullet , I thought it would be a lot closer but it really wasn't even a question. It's been YEARS since I felt the way watching wrestling and rooting for guys the way I loved The Shield when they were running rampant over the WWE and easily the most consistent and best part of the show every single night. There was literally a probably 6 month stretch where we would just fun RAW MVP threads and The Shield were the foregone conclusion for the winner. 

They were just great , and the think I love the most about them looking back is that they weren't your typical faction with guys in defined roles. There wasn't the main eventer , the tag team and the mid-card guy - they were all equals. All capable of whooping your ass in just as brutal fashion as the guy standing next to them. Yes Roman was the obvious poster boy for the future but during the substantial part of their run they were truly brothers in arms and no one rose above the rest. They brought everything to the table and had amazing chemistry - especially in the ring. 

I remember being at the Elimination Chamber Pay Per View where they fought The Wyatts in a fucking great match and getting goosebumps when you'd hear SIERRA , HOTEL , INDIA , ECHO , LIMA , DELTA. Very few wrestling experiences match that for me. 

Their breakup sucked and broke my heart but I do get why they did it - and they all proved what they were capable of on their own by going on to have great careers and that just harkens back to why they were so incredible as a unit and KAYFABE wise , I'm not sure there is a more dominant group of guys. 

Loved when they made their recent return to the product , probably the last cool thing the WWE did. Love that The Shield remained the WWE's biggest draw outside of Brock up until Dean left. Dean's leaving makes me saddest because I know it's going to be a long ass time before we see The Shield again - I'm happy for him to get out of that place but annoyed that one of my favorite acts of all time is persona non grata for probably the next decade. 

May 31, 2019 16:34:45 GMT Baker said:

The Birds/Von Erichs July 4th "Come As You Are" street fight has my highest recommendation. That was my working #1 for the proposed 6 Man Tag Countdown a while back. I don't understand why it hasn't been entered into the canon of Great 80s Brawls. It was like a street fight between two rival gangs.

I assume you are talking about the 7/4/84 Badstreet Match, yeah? I only ask because there are other Freebirds/Von Erich matches labelled as "Come As You Are" matches and they had a match the previous Independence Day on 7/4/83 that many hold up as the best ever World Class match that I cannot find anywhere online. If anyone can lend a hand, it would be very welcome.

I imagine some of these matches have not quite reached the status of other 80s brawls simply due to lack of accessibility. Case in point being that I cannot find perhaps the best WCCW match online, neither of these July 4th matches were on the WWE-released World Class DVD and they aren't on the Network that I can find. They have the Collection section on the Network that takes you through pivotal angles and matches in a wrestler/factions career, but it should be bigger. Having a collection of all the Freebirds/Von Erich matches and the best promos/angles is precisely the sort of thing that should be on there.

As UT mentioned, the 1984 July 4th match was the WON MOTY, likely helped by Meltzer being there live and pimping it in the Observer. Although it is far from a poor choice.

The Shield is a perfect example of the whole being greater than the sum of its parts. Reigns, Ambrose and Rollins all excelled in different areas and so could be used perfectly to emphasise each others strengths and hide each others weaknesses.

I love the way they were booked. They came out of nowhere and wrestled almost exclusively as a team, so the viewers had no idea where they lay on the singles totem pole, but they were top dogs in the six man tag world. They were consistently producing phenomenal six man tag team matches at a time where tag team wrestling was pretty lousy.

I think The Shield were broken up way too early, but given Vince's boner for betrayals and team breakups, it's perhaps a miracle they lasted as long as they did. They still had plenty of mileage in the tank. In fact, I think they should have remained a team forever. They could split into singles careers without losing their brotherhood. Even have them wrestle on different brands, and come together at joint PPVs.

I didn’t vote for The Shield. I liked them all as individuals and thought they were better on their own.

Good stable, sure, had some good matches yeah, and if we did a “top wrestlers of the last 10 years” list all 3 of these guys would be on it, but I wanted my list to be good groups that I enjoyed no matter what and The Shield was never that to me.

I said that the DA had a pretty unparalleled run in terms of good matches in a short spell as a collective but The Shield would be a contender, though their run was longer. Their debut match was fantastic (some might still argue it was their best), they followed it up with a very good match on their next PPV and they produced loads of good TV matches. Ambrose was the defacto leader and the singles competitor while Reigns/Rollins were a top team.

That first Wyatts match is still a contender for my favourite WWE match of the decade. The Shield had been presented so well as being the ultimate team, able to utilise superior teamwork and working towards getting a numbers advantage to get the win. Then the Wyatts were able to do a Shield to the Shield. Excellent storytelling. The follow-up matches were great too but it was all rushed sadly. The Wyatts feud should've been 6 months minimum. All the singles, tag and 6-man permutations to work through.

There was money in the newly face Shield and it was over far too soon. They did not need to split when they did. Even if you wanted to move more towards them all going solo, none of them needed to turn in 2014. Have their own singles feuds and team up on special occasions. Even if you turned one of them, it didn't need to be against each other. Could've done that face Sting/heel Luger 1995 WCW dynamic. We are still pals, but you've changed, can I still trust you? Could've delayed them feuding with each other until 2016, 2017. The Shield reunion could've only just been happening right now.

They also kept Rollins in tag matches and away from doing "epic" singles matches that aren't good, so that's a plus.

I had the Shield at 12. Their look, entrance and waging war on anyone earned them points. But the fact that they are in a dead era and did next to nothing to bring WWE out of it put them behind the gang war era stables. They had great matches when teamed together but with the exception of Dean Ambrose at times they were charisma vacuums that just didn't fully resonate with me.

The Shield was my #7. Easily the best stable of the last 10 years or so. I disagree about putting under the Gang War stable though, the only stable from that era I had higher was DX. I definitely have the Shield higher than Los Boriquas or The Disciples of Apocalypse, or any other such nonsense. I have them over the NOD as well.

I couldn't put them in my top 5 though. As much fun as they were to watch, their historical impact is really limited.

The words UT said to describe The Shield make me wish I put them too 3! I fucking should have.

Why?

Because he’s fucking right. Once their theme hit, it was LETS FUCKING GO time. Their 6 man tag matches were always MOTY candidates IMO and I absolutely had to be home when The Shield/Wyatt feud got under way. I remember telling my wife how fucking epic this shit was when they stood on opposite sides of the apron and had that stare down. And then when they got into the ring, it was PREMATURE EJACULATION for me. Find any group that’s made that impact in the last 20 fucking years. You just can’t.

Historical and longevity aside, they did what many couldn’t do for years together. They came. They saw. They conquered. I’ll go one further then UT did. I don’t think we will ever see The Shield again. I don’t think Ambrose is that type of guy to come back.

I don’t understand how one could say their historical impact is limited. They’ve feuded (and dominated) two of the factions to make this list - including the 7th greatest faction of all time according to PW.

All three members became grand slam champions. That’s impact.

They were consistently the best performers on damn near every show they were on. Huge impact.

They may not have changed the business in ways factions yet to come have but they made a ton of impact on the business during their time together.

Strobe Yeah, that's the one. Rewatching it just now reminded me of the stupid Killer Khan finish. Everything other than the camerawork is great up to that point. While I may have come around on the Freebirds (almost two decades ago now!), the appeal of Killer Khan remains a mystery to me, and I've always thought his interference leading to the finish was a major letdown.

Love that writeup from UT . I also love how UT loves the Shield.

I had the Shield at #7. They were my highest ranking stable of the 2010s.

I obviously wasn't following wrestling regularly when The Shield were a thing, but I paid enough attention to know they were PW favorites, and I have seen a handful of their greatest hits. They definitely made an impact, as a team, and then later on as singles competitors.

One thing I liked about The Shield was how each member had a different style- Rollins was the flyer, Ambrose the brawler, and Reigns the hoss. I've been lead to believe they won like a zillion 6 man tags before their first loss because they were a team with better teamwork than a bunch of randomly thrown together dudes. If so, that is awesome. Like Raven (the wrestler, not the old PW poster), I have long been of the belief that a great team should almost always beat two (or three) great singles wrestlers not accustomed to tagging. This is one reason I'm such a stickler for "real tag teams" whenever we do tag team countdowns.

Their 'late 90s Bossman' look was kind of lame imo. I'm pretty sure that was actually my initial reaction the first time I saw them- "Why are they dressed like late 90s Bossman, and how is that supposed to be cool?" But it seems to have worked, so whatever.

From my admittedly limited viewing, I liked Rollins & Reigns while thinking Ambrose was pretty terrible. 

I've seen the famous Wyatt match and the Evolution matches, but they're honestly mostly a blur some five years later. Couldn't tell you much about them beyond a handful of details in the Wyatt match, but I did enjoy them at the time. My favorite Shield matches are Rollins & Reigns tags against The Usos from some PPV and the awesome Raw match with Cody & Goldust.