"The city of Dayton no longer will hire employees who use nicotine or tobacco, citing the desire for a healthier workplace and environment.



Employees hired after July 15 are required to be nicotine and tobacco free as long as they work for the city.The city plans to test for nicotine and tobacco during the pre-employment screening process and when it receives “reliable” information that an employee is using the products."

"“Studies indicate that employees that smoke cost approximately an additional $6,000 per year in direct medical costs and lost productivity,” said Kenneth Couch, Dayton’s director of human resources."

www.daytondailynews.com/news/local/dayton-stops-hiring-smokers-vapers-union-worries-about-slippery-slope/tXP9EZuGWK6l34Nn8lNU1N/

Despite what you may assume due to me working in the tobacco and nicotine industry I am not instantly opposed to this.  But do you think this is going too far as nicotine is a legal product?  I feel it could be a basis for some sort of future debate point on marijuana use as well.  Kind of a whole personal privacy case.

Aug 1, 2019 15:19:48 GMT theend said:

"The city of Dayton no longer will hire employees who use nicotine or tobacco, citing the desire for a healthier workplace and environment.



Employees hired after July 15 are required to be nicotine and tobacco free as long as they work for the city.The city plans to test for nicotine and tobacco during the pre-employment screening process and when it receives “reliable” information that an employee is using the products."

"“Studies indicate that employees that smoke cost approximately an additional $6,000 per year in direct medical costs and lost productivity,” said Kenneth Couch, Dayton’s director of human resources."

www.daytondailynews.com/news/local/dayton-stops-hiring-smokers-vapers-union-worries-about-slippery-slope/tXP9EZuGWK6l34Nn8lNU1N/

Despite what you may assume due to me working in the tobacco and nicotine industry I am not instantly opposed to this.  But do you think this is going too far as nicotine is a legal product?  I feel it could be a basis for some sort of future debate point on marijuana use as well.  Kind of a whole personal privacy case.

Very interesting ground to be treading on, Dayton.

From one perspective, I feel like I should be allowed to do anything to my own body that I want on my own time... So long as it doesn't effect my job performance or somehow reflect on my employer, then the employer shouldn't give a fuck (or at least not be able to hold it against me somehow).

However, if I was a business owner, I'd definitely want the right to be able to hire who I wanted... And if that was drug-free non-smokers, so be it. Especially factoring in the perspective that I'm paying health benefits to someone who's actively destroying their health.

And then there's the whole smoke break thing...

My first job in a family-owned hardware store, I was jealous of all my coworkers because they all smoked and consequently took 5-10 minute smoke breaks seemingly every 30-60 minutes. I remember seeing this and debating taking up smoking as a teen just so I could work less too.

Even now I'm a little jealous of/pissed at coworkers who are seemingly always on a smoke break. And I feel like there's this weird smoking hypocrisy... Like I've always hated cigarettes, but those seem to be the only thing that warrants a smoke break. If I wanted to enjoy a cigar or pipe, I feel like I'd be scorned... Even by the smoking crowd.

And then what about the people who indulge in smokeless tobacco? It's gross as fuck, but at least there were never any productivity dips (no pun intended) at least not with the crew I worked with back in my coal mining days.

🤯, also include vape, e-cig, tobacco cessation products etc. For you nicotine users out there, there is a new generation of products out and growing which are nicotine pouches. Food grade base with nicotine in a pouch. Upper lip, no spit, discrete, etc. Basically, vape for snuff or snus.

I work part time catering. The measurable productivity between smoker and non smoker is huge.

When I was job searching over the areas a network of hospitals always advertised they were smoke free. No idea if that's the medical field in general or just them. They are also located in and around Dayton. So if it's not a mandatory thing across the country... wonder if they pioneered it and the city stole the concept.

Without reading said link... is that a thing for only new employees? Like if you started in June or earlier is there still a smoking section for you? I imagine not, right?

That should be fucking illegal to do.

Explain to me where productivity is calculated between smokers/non smokers at work? Because "so and so goes out for a cigarette every hour?" Is that literally the basis we are going by? Should we ban people with small bladders too because they go pee too often?

I smoke and I work my ass off. Productivity in a work place studies are all bullshit. It depends on the person. Some say black people are lazy, but I know some black people that work like animals. There are fat people that are lazy and move slower then everyone BUT there are some that still bust their ass. Should we ban colored people and people over a certain weight? Dumb shit. This sounds like a lawsuit, because it's inhumane and fucking stupid. Fuck Dayton; those cheap penny pinching cocksuckers.

Aug 1, 2019 17:13:10 GMT KING KID said:

That should be fucking illegal to do.

Explain to me where productivity is calculated between smokers/non smokers at work? Because "so and so goes out for a cigarette every hour?" Is that literally the basis we are going by? Should we ban people with small bladders too because they go pee too often?

I smoke and I work my ass off. Productivity in a work place studies are all bullshit. It depends on the person. Some say black people are lazy, but I know some black people that work like animals. There are fat people that are lazy and move slower then everyone BUT there are some that still bust their ass. Should we ban colored people and people over a certain weight? Dumb shit. This sounds like a lawsuit, because it's inhumane and fucking stupid. Fuck Dayton; those cheap penny pinching cocksuckers.

People don't choose their skin color.

People choose to use tobacco products.

Not sure I see the connection there?

Obesity and bladders sound more like medical issues, which I think are protected too (even if people SHOULD lose weight).

YOU SMOKE BRO?! DO YOU SMOKE?! DO YOU KNOW WHAT IT'S LIKE TO BE A SMOKER?! NO YOU DON'T!

They aint doing it for health issues, bro. They're doing it because they like to micromanage everything and pinch every minute out of their workers. Sounds so fucking stupid, useless and pointless.

Word is shinobimusashi is also adding this policy to his company because fuck if he can find anyone as it is!

This one hits close to home... Literally. The comment section on WHIO's facebook post about this is a gold mine of people posting sarcastic hypothetical examples of where this government overreach could possibly lead to: "No more caffeine at the workplace", "no more donuts on lunch breaks", etc. etc.

Dayton City Council has been fucking up hard lately, with all the money that's gone unaccounted for in their payroll and when the city paid millions of dollars to keep the streets safe during a KKK rally where only nine assholes even showed up.

I considered moving back there recently but all these events and other matters have made me reconsider.

Aug 1, 2019 18:52:37 GMT KING KID said:

YOU SMOKE BRO?! DO YOU SMOKE?! DO YOU KNOW WHAT IT'S LIKE TO BE A SMOKER?! NO YOU DON'T!

They aint doing it for health issues, bro. They're doing it because they like to micromanage everything and pinch every minute out of their workers. Sounds so fucking stupid, useless and pointless.

Huh?

Cigars and weed. Fuck cigarettes. They's nasties.

Aug 1, 2019 19:43:03 GMT @ness said:

Word is shinobimusashi is also adding this policy to his company because fuck if he can find anyone as it is!

:rofl:

Not sure what the difference is between this and saying “the city won’t hire anyone whose BMI suggests they’re obese” or “anyone who drinks alcohol”. Neither of those would be acceptable.

Not defending smoker rights because fuck smokers, but don’t let them smoke on the job or at the workplace, or on any of the property the workplace owns, etc. Telling someone they can’t do a completely legal activity off the clock is not okay with me.

Should ban anyone who drives to work. Worse for the environment, and more dangerous than nicotine use.

My workplaces rule on it

A little off topic, but if Marijuana is medically and recreationally legal in my state, should I be allowed to smoke (or otherwise consume) it during my breaks? Or at least after work with no drug testing repercussions?

Considering the FBI or whoever said they have no intention of pursuing pot crimes unless it's against dealing shit in massive quantities or to kids, I feel like that whole "well, federally it's still illegal" paper argument is bullshit thin.

Mainly, I stare at so many spreadsheets all day I'm really starting like I need to be high during in order to stay focused but more importantly keep my sanity.

Aug 2, 2019 10:56:29 GMT 🤯 said:

A little off topic, but if Marijuana is medically and recreationally legal in my state, should I be allowed to smoke (or otherwise consume) it during my breaks? Or at least after work with no drug testing repercussions?

Considering the FBI or whoever said they have no intention of pursuing pot crimes unless it's against dealing shit in massive quantities or to kids, I feel like that whole "well, federally it's still illegal" paper argument is bullshit thin.

Mainly, I stare at so many spreadsheets all day I'm really starting like I need to be high during in order to stay focused but more importantly keep my sanity.

No for the same reason you shouldn’t be able to drink at lunch. Not that they’re the same, but on the same wavelength to keep me from letting any of my employees doing it.

And if the “it’s still illegal” argument is BS, the “I work better stoned” one is one I’d take off the table. Maybe that’s true of 1 out of every 10, but 9 stoners are ruining it.

Aug 2, 2019 0:52:41 GMT c said:

Should ban anyone who drives to work. Worse for the environment, and more dangerous than nicotine use.

What about carpooling?

What about just the tip?


The whole I work better stoned thing is bullshit for most people. There are some people it is true for, but it is usually people in chronic pain or with sky high anxiety and not the people that generally hold full time jobs.

People are bad at self-assessing to begin with. We know marijuana interferes with objective assessment as speed tests show, so do to expect an accurate self-assessment from someone under the influence is insane.

Aug 2, 2019 0:19:29 GMT mikec said:

Not sure what the difference is between this and saying “the city won’t hire anyone whose BMI suggests they’re obese” or “anyone who drinks alcohol”. Neither of those would be acceptable.

Not defending smoker rights because fuck smokers, but don’t let them smoke on the job or at the workplace, or on any of the property the workplace owns, etc. Telling someone they can’t do a completely legal activity off the clock is not okay with me.

The difference is society looks down upon smoking and you get looked down on if you dare speak out against fat people.

Medically speaking obesity would be the same as smoking with respect to logic presented by the story about increased medical costs. But snowflakes must not be offended.

The funny thing is in private most snowflakes trash fat people while preaching tolerance publically.  Callout culture is weird when two oppressed groups intersect.  

Aug 3, 2019 4:10:56 GMT c said:

The funny thing is in private most snowflakes trash fat people while preaching tolerance publically.  Callout culture is weird when two oppressed groups intersect.  

Yeah intolerance, racism, prejudice has just moved further behind private walls. And then outside we don't speak out for fear of the reaction

Dude I could smoke a blunt to the head and work circles around every one of you fuckers. And then go home and outwork EVERYBODY in the gym and then run 5 miles. I smoke a lot of weed and the fact of the matter is that you couldn't wear my rig on your best day, bottom line son. Deal with it.

Aug 3, 2019 13:41:06 GMT shinobimusashi said:

Dude I could smoke a blunt to the head and work circles around every one of you fuckers. And then go home and outwork EVERYBODY in the gym and then run 5 miles. I smoke a lot of weed and the fact of the matter is that you couldn't wear my rig on your best day, bottom line son. Deal with it.

Preach, Nobe!

Maybe I have sky high anxiety then. All I know is that all the bullshit number staring I currently do eventually causes my brain to break. I hit a point of diminishing returns, and then probably start doing more damage than good if I keep pushing.

Even if I'm working much slower, I think the calmed focus that I've found weed imparts on me quiets Add-like impulses and would allow me to stick with sifting through a bunch of blah blah data to complete some uber mundane reporting and analysis. Plus, it's just financial shit anyway... Which is even more creative license than fan fiction.

Also, I think I'm gonna start taking imaginary smoke breaks. Just head outside every fifteen minutes and smoke invisible cigs. If anyone asks, just tell them I need my nicotine fix. Why not?

Fuck late stage capitalism, et cetera!

I would like to test in real life one of you running circles around me. Or better yet going harder and longer than nazzer,.

Aug 3, 2019 13:41:06 GMT shinobimusashi said:

Dude I could smoke a blunt to the head and work circles around every one of you fuckers. And then go home and outwork EVERYBODY in the gym and then run 5 miles. I smoke a lot of weed and the fact of the matter is that you couldn't wear my rig on your best day, bottom line son. Deal with it.

Weird flex but ok

I wouldn't hire anyone that smoked cigarettes.
Mostly because I wouldn't hire a retard.
If you have an occasion puff I wouldn't care but if you blaze every day you fall into category one.

Aug 3, 2019 15:58:45 GMT iNCY said:

I wouldn't hire anyone that smoked cigarettes.
Mostly because I wouldn't hire a retard.
If you have an occasion puff I wouldn't care but if you blaze every day you fall into category one.

You can’t hire me. I QUIT!

I wonder if people working in the cannabis industry are generally encouraged or discouraged from partaking?

Honestly I'm not sure how shinobimusashi could deal with being in the heat all day unless he was high off his ass. That said I'm coming over one day to smoke a bowl and whip that ass in Mortal Kombat for the Sega Genesis.