I like the hybrid commentary team. I feel like they all feed off each other well.

Thumbs up from me. Fresh, unpredictable. Run-ins, drama, and a hook for next week. Very 90s, and I fucking loved it. Full review tomorrow.

Oct 3, 2019 18:27:43 GMT Ed said:

I like the hybrid commentary team. I feel like they all feed off each other well.

Schiavone did a nice job! This was a lot better than I expected, I'm in.

Oct 3, 2019 2:03:48 GMT Blindy said:

Oct 3, 2019 2:00:46 GMT KING KID said:

I figured Blindy would get pumped for that lol.

I still remember Lony and I stood tall when Swags won the WHW title years ago in the Elimination Chamber!

Yep, love that Swagger is back with a major promotion. Big fan of his, and I'm def interested in what they do long term.

Oct 3, 2019 21:38:51 GMT Todd said:

Oct 3, 2019 18:27:43 GMT Ed said:

I like the hybrid commentary team. I feel like they all feed off each other well.

Schiavone did a nice job! This was a lot better than I expected, I'm in.

I wasn't thrilled about JR going to AEW but he had a pleasantly surprising amount of energy. I thought Tony did a fine job exhibiting the same level of surprise, although I was cautiously optimistic with him. They don't have to be their best selves just show enthusiasm for the product and allow Excalibur to raise them up. If that stays in tact I'll be on board.

Oct 4, 2019 0:29:30 GMT Ed said:

Oct 3, 2019 21:38:51 GMT Todd said:

Schiavone did a nice job! This was a lot better than I expected, I'm in.

I wasn't thrilled about JR going to AEW but he had a pleasantly surprising amount of energy. I thought Tony did a fine job exhibiting the same level of surprise, although I was cautiously optimistic with him. They don't have to be their best selves just show enthusiasm for the product and allow Excalibur to raise them up. If that stays in tact I'll be on board.

I've watched all their shows, and this is definitely their best announce team combo yet. Tony's performance last night night felt like a well done version of what Mike tansy was supposed to be in wcw, a history book type guy except u didn't want to punch him the way u wanted to punch tenay. And excalibur is just great.

Oct 3, 2019 14:49:54 GMT c said:

Fairly sure PAC issue was visa related. A bunch of people were having visa issues around that time.

Super psyched to see Swagger back. Him and Page I think can tear down the house. He has been around enough that he may just be able to be himself and do that as a character.

Awesome to see Riho take the title. She is so amazing.

PAC had visa issues in March, but there was still reportedly issues which is why they sent Page over to lose to PAC in the UK, even though it made no sense for the direction of the company.

I'm sure there's more details out there, but the point was that everything surrounding PAC has been messy and usually the promoter's will take their pound of flesh for having to put up with the rubbish.

So I loved the show. Truth be told, and I don't think I'm alone in this, I'm so fucking exhausted with WWE's vanilla, formulaic presentation and dead crowds that anything remotely resembling a fresh, hot wrestling show was going to get me excited. This did, and then some. I have some criticisms though:

- The show open was mixed. I don't like the powder paint open or the font - it looks tacky and amateur. Admittedly, in going up against WWE they are going against one of the best live production companies in the world, but for me it fell short. I'm fine with the music.

- JR's open was fucking awesome and took me back. Immediately felt hyped up.

- First match was good. Sammy Guevara didn't make a huge impression but he looked decent. The match did what was asked of it, put Cody over without hurting Guevara in the process. Cody has been a revelation in this promotion IMO. I was always high on him, but he looks a star, works like a star, and is so over it's unreal. It's absolutely right he has the next world title shot, he is the hottest face in the company outside of Moxley who has barely worked so far. Jericho beat-down was fine.

- MJF had a good showcase. He has the potential to be the talent of his generation if he can wrap it all together. Brandon Cutler isn't up to much. I agree with MJF, he looks like a member of the crowd. Not much of a worker either from what we see here. But it doesn't matter, it got MJF over and established him as a major player.

- Page and Pac was really good. Pac was the best wrestler in WWE when he was there and he showed all of those qualities. I like Page and I hope they build him slowly. He's another one like MJF that ticks all the boxes.

- Everything I've seen from Nyla Rose so far has been awful, but this wasn't too bad. JR was sloppy on commentary here for the first time, harping on about the size difference. The finish was really hot and the crowd got into it. Riho winning was a surprise and I wouldn't have done it personally but the girl can wrestle. Kenny Omega getting involved was weird, so consistent with Kenny Omega.

- The Young Bucks are fucking awful and I honestly wish they would just fucking go away. It's like they're on an assault course, trying to tag as many different points around the ring as quickly as possible while doing no fucking damage to anything in sight. They literally make me angry. Plus their faces just look like they need a slap. Absolute pair of Marty Jannetty's that just need to fuck off forever. Kenny Omega's weird body language doesn't do it for me but at least he doesn't break the suspension of disbelief. Jericho, Santana and Ortiz were all solid.

- I loved the aftermath for reasons I've already mentioned. This show tonight had everything good about the 90s, and left all of the nonsense at the door. It was great. There was some silliness I suppose, with Evans and Angelico who just came off as try-hards. And the SCU/LB stand-off was a corny setup and I doubt we see it again. Hager is a weird one for me. He is a goof, he should be booked as such. Promoters are insistent on making the guy the next Brock Lesnar and I appreciate that he's the closest thing athletically but he has none of the menace that sets Brock apart. Book Hager for what he is, a somewhat funny, love-able goof who will kill you if you push his buttons.

Overall, 8/10. Can't wait until next week. Big credit to Tony Schiavone who was great and instantly relaxed JR who seemed so happy to have a familiar face at the booth with him. Excalibur stopped it from becoming antiquated with his fresh twist of modern wrestling thoughts. Good job.

I'm watching the show now and going to brain dump my thoughts. Like a one-post party thread.

- Love the opening of the show. The fireworks, the crowd shots, the announcer intro. Sure, this is no different from WWE or any other big US wrestling show, but I'm getting a little bit of nostalgia when I used to enjoy watching WWE. Never really heard Tony Schiavone announce before, but I'm already getting a good feeling about him.

- Cody vs Guevara promo video is good. Definitely like the sports-oriented presentation. The closer to a real athletic competition it is, the better. Which is why I love classic All Japan and current New Japan.

- Cody is super over. Good for him. There was criticism about the decision to have Cody open the show, but I'm definitely siding with Big Pete's point of view that it was a great idea. I like Sammy's headdress but man he didn't take that off with much respect.

- Never seen Sammy before. He's got a lot of heat without doing anything. Not sure whether it's just because he's facing top face Cody, or whether he did something to earn that heat.

- The opening match was really well put together. I liked it. Nothing especially flashy, but it had a nice flow and kept me engaged from start to finish. Cody busting out the Oz Cutter was a shocked. Also really dig Guevara responding with a cutter of his own. Got the feeling that these guys aren't just trotting out their signature moves: they are using moves according to the situation they are in. I might be wrong about this, but I had the impression that this was a top guy vs midcard guy kinda match. If that's true, then I thought some of the near falls were a bit excessive. I really hope AEW can set itself apart by not being a company where every wrestler can only win matches in one way - hitting their finisher. In that sense Cody winning with a rollup while on the defensive was nice, but the fact that Guevara kicked out of the Disaster Kick + Brandi boot shot, and a top rope reverse suplex thing, is not encouraging in that respect. All in all, a very good match to open your promotion with. Riddle vs Cole will receive a lot more snowflakes, but I can guarantee that personally, I wouldn't have enjoyed the NXT match as much.

- Jericho beatdown seemed cliché at first, but it was given that sprinkle of originality by Jerico casually walking back up the ramp and announcing that "I am Chris Jericho and I am the champion". Established that he didn't have any particular animosity towards Cody, he just beat him up for the hell of it, because he's the champ, and he likes beating people up, and he wants the spotlight. Also a good booking decision to get your champion and most recognisable face out on the screen relatively early, try to keep the attention of the fence-sitters.

- Never seen MJF before. I get instant EC3 vibes. Posh name. Scarf. Eloquent, but also arrogant and dickish, fairly generic crowd insults. I understand that it's hard to be truly original in pro-wrestling, but he still needs to convince me he's more than an EC3 ripoff. Get in the ring, pal, and prove yourself.

- Taunting while in the initial lockup, followed by a high school-style trip. Good start to the match. He's standing out. Rest of the match was unremarkable from the point of view of MJF.

- Brandon Cutler got a lot of hate in this thread, but I liked what little I saw. The suicide dive/Thesz press hybrid is a really cool move and a great way to start a babyface comeback. He covered up his falling-off-the-top-rope botch incredibly well, to the point where I'm not even convinced it was a botch. These two guys are fairly young, so it's hard to believe they put that entire finishing sequence together on the fly following that botch, but I'm not ruling it out either. Could be that MJF intended to roll out of the way of his dive and go to the same finish that they did, but Cutler slipped and improvised a knee buckle sell. If that's true, huge kudos to Cutler.

- I know people age, but I wish I hadn't seen middle-aged Jay and Silent Bob. Didn't care much for the segment, but I appreciate it as a nice way to segue into the tag tournament bracket. SCU/Lucha Bros promo was cool, but how can Lucha Bros call themselves the best tag team in the universe while being the personal jobbers to the Young Bucks?

- Here comes the Hangman. I'm sure when I watched All Out, they had the win-loss record on the graphic with the wrestler's name. I thought that was a really awesome touch that legitimised the promotion and what they stand for. I hope it's not gone for good. Speaking of little things to add legitimacy, I like the 20 minute time limit. A good length for a TV match on a 2 hour show, and prevents the wrestlers getting too excessive.

- Wow, grandpa Earl Hebner is still a ref? Good for him, I guess.

- PAC vs Page was a NJPW-style slugfest, so of course I liked it. Would have fit right into the G1 Climax. Loved the little touch with Hebner being suspicious after PAC hit the low blow, but unable to do anything. One thing I love about Page's wrestling is that his dives mean something. He hits them with impact, and they always fit well in the match. I never get the feeling he does a dive just because it's a thing you have to do in a 2019 wrestling match.

- I had a hard time buying Riho against Hikaru Shida. It's even worse against Nyla. Her forearms are awful, and I cannot believe she's able to Irish Whip or headscissor someone twice the size of her. I cannot believe she's able to hurt Nyla in any way. I try to suspend disbelief when watching wrestlers who are short or skinny, but this is too much. Of course, Nyla is a moron and suicides herself by diving onto some chairs. Why would Nyla need to do that? Only so Riho has a plausible way to come back into the match.

- The weird rollup that got a great near fall was the best offense Riho did all match. Finish sucked. I can't buy Riho at all against an opponent like Nyla. Nyla is pretty good though. A better version of Nia Jax.

I'm tired and I'm going to bed. Part 2 tomorrow!

Oct 4, 2019 22:26:26 GMT Emperor said:

- Never seen MJF before. I get instant EC3 vibes. Posh name. Scarf. Eloquent, but also arrogant and dickish, fairly generic crowd insults. I understand that it's hard to be truly original in pro-wrestling, but he still needs to convince me he's more than an EC3 ripoff. Get in the ring, pal, and prove yourself.

- I had a hard time buying Riho against Hikaru Shida. It's even worse against Nyla. Her forearms are awful, and I cannot believe she's able to Irish Whip or headscissor someone twice the size of her. I cannot believe she's able to hurt Nyla in any way. I try to suspend disbelief when watching wrestlers who are short or skinny, but this is too much. Of course, Nyla is a moron and suicides herself by diving onto some chairs. Why would Nyla need to do that? Only so Riho has a plausible way to come back into the match.

I would think he would remind a person of ADR over EC3.

I agree with this. I know smaller people can over come bigger people. But when you are under 100 lbs and your strikes don't look that impactful already there is a problem

MJF def has potential. He just needs to really iron out his character as he still feels very generic.

I love Jericho is reinventing himself again as a bully. Bully Jericho is gonna be a lot of fun.

- Watching with a fresh pair of eyes, I notice that they do have the win/loss records on the name graphics. I just missed them last night.

- Gotta say, the main event feels like a big deal, particularly when Jericho made his entrance.

- The match itself was obviously a vehicle for a number of angles and appearances, but as a whole I thought it was well put together. Moxley's appearance was great. All the run-ins after the match made sense, were timed well, and kept escalating the situation. Hager's surprise appearance was awesome and had the desired effect on the crowd. Good stuff.

- The Judas Effect is still terrible. The one time it looked remotely good was in the match against Hangman Page.

Overall, I really liked what I saw. It definitely has a different vibe from WWE, without having a totally difference aesthetic as Lucha Underground does. The focus on wins and losses and a more sports-like presentation is a very good thing. The variety of talent and match styles on offer is excellent, a nice contrast to the homogenised WWE, and even NJPW to an extent, which can sometimes fall into a pattern of every match having the same style. What I like most, perhaps, is the attention to the little details. It's clear that the booking has been very well thought out.

I gave some examples in my previous post, but the main event is a perfect example. Omega got took out early, so it ended up a 3 vs 2 Handicap match. In WWE, the Young Bucks would have fought on even terms with their three opponents, and it wouldn't have felt like a Handicap match at all because the babyfaces have to be gods. Not here. Although Nick Jackson got the hot tag and baet up all three opponents for a while, it didn't last, and the moment Team Jericho got on top, the match was over in under a minute. That's the way it should be. Good stuff, and I look forward to seeing more. Furthermore, that match had a whole undercurrent of Jericho being the captain of his team, giving small little directions to his younger teammates. This was established in a backstage segment earlier in the show, and they kept that continuity going. I love it.

Oct 4, 2019 19:49:18 GMT Todd said:

The Young Bucks are fucking awful and I honestly wish they would just fucking go away. It's like they're on an assault course, trying to tag as many different points around the ring as quickly as possible while doing no fucking damage to anything in sight. They literally make me angry. Plus their faces just look like they need a slap. Absolute pair of Marty Jannetty's that just need to fuck off forever. Kenny Omega's weird body language doesn't do it for me but at least he doesn't break the suspension of disbelief. Jericho, Santana and Ortiz were all solid.

You feel a lot more strongly about them than I do, but yeah, they are like the tag team equivalent of Kenny Omega, but much worse. It's a shame, because they are perfectly capable of having great storytelling/psychology heavy matches. I've seen it. But they prefer to go "All Out", in super duper spotfest Ladder matches, and super duper spotfest non-Ladder matches. To be fair, it works very well for them, and they clearly appeal to the modern wrestling fan, in the same way that the Gargano/Cole/Strong/Riddle style of pure excess works in NXT. It's just not for me.

Oct 5, 2019 12:55:37 GMT Emperor said:

Oct 4, 2019 19:49:18 GMT Todd said:

The Young Bucks are fucking awful and I honestly wish they would just fucking go away. It's like they're on an assault course, trying to tag as many different points around the ring as quickly as possible while doing no fucking damage to anything in sight. They literally make me angry. Plus their faces just look like they need a slap. Absolute pair of Marty Jannetty's that just need to fuck off forever. Kenny Omega's weird body language doesn't do it for me but at least he doesn't break the suspension of disbelief. Jericho, Santana and Ortiz were all solid.

You feel a lot more strongly about them than I do, but yeah, they are like the tag team equivalent of Kenny Omega, but much worse. It's a shame, because they are perfectly capable of having great storytelling/psychology heavy matches. I've seen it. But they prefer to go "All Out", in super duper spotfest Ladder matches, and super duper spotfest non-Ladder matches. To be fair, it works very well for them, and they clearly appeal to the modern wrestling fan, in the same way that the Gargano/Cole/Strong/Riddle style of pure excess works in NXT. It's just not for me.

Thing that makes the bucks ok in aew is that the shows have all been varied enough in match style that one match like this isn't going to kill the whole show for me.

Not a fan of the one hour shorten version on Saturday. I was just thinking this isn't a bad spot for some Saturday wrestling. I didn't realize it was one hour so after Cody vs. Sammy we got the long beat up then commercial break into six man tag.

Re: The Young Bucks. I’ve soured on them quite a bit over the years but I’ve still really enjoyed their matches against Lucha Bros.

They’re not Marty Jannettys, they’re if two sober Jeff Hardys teamed up. And being spot monkeys is what made them super famous and got them booked like unbeatable gods in ROH and NJPW, so why change it up?

I’ve grown bored of them lately and I didn’t like how they held the NJPW tag titles for like their entire careers there, especially now that they paid NJPW back by leaving at the peak of their fame there. But like I said, the Lucha Bros matches were good.

I’m not sure where they’re going with The Elite, Omega losing, the Bucks and the tag tournament. I’m going to withhold judgment for now, but I’m not enjoying it.

Oct 5, 2019 14:59:09 GMT RT said:

Re: The Young Bucks. I’ve soured on them quite a bit over the years but I’ve still really enjoyed their matches against Lucha Bros.

They’re not Marty Jannettys, they’re if two sober Jeff Hardys teamed up. And being spot monkeys is what made them super famous and got them booked like unbeatable gods in ROH and NJPW, so why change it up?

I’ve grown bored of them lately and I didn’t like how they held the NJPW tag titles for like their entire careers there, especially now that they paid NJPW back by leaving at the peak of their fame there. But like I said, the Lucha Bros matches were good.

I’m not sure where they’re going with The Elite, Omega losing, the Bucks and the tag tournament. I’m going to withhold judgment for now, but I’m not enjoying it.

They’re going to feud with Jericho’s stable. Jericho just formed his own elite:

He’s the cocky Canadian that was told he’s too small (Jericho/Kenny)

They got the Indy darling tag team (LAX/Bucks)

The arrogant young star (Sammy/Page)

The WWE defector (Jake/Cody)

They won’t all battle at once, but these are a bunch of comic nerds: They just establishes their heel analogues on Night One.

Jericho's teammates are LAX? I know I'm way behind the times, but to me LAX is Homicide and Hernandez. Someone get me up to speed on LAX.

Oct 5, 2019 16:55:57 GMT Emperor said:

Jericho's teammates are LAX? I know I'm way behind the times, but to me LAX is Homicide and Hernandez. Someone get me up to speed on LAX.

Konnan has always been the leader of LAX. He introduced Santana and Ortiz as LAX during the beginning of Anthem owning TNA. Homicide was part of the group toward the beginning but more of secondary leader type roll. He disappeared for a while then came back with Hernandez with Eddie Kingston in a Konnan position to feud with new LAX. New LAX won and pretty much dominate TNA Impact/Impact Wrestling while they were there and held the title more days then anyone at 600+ days.

And the Jericho/LAX connection makes sense because Jericho and Konnan are good friends in real life and Konnan is (or was?) a part of Jericho's podcast network.

This was a big show and a great debut. I just hope next week is not a let down.

The crowd was hot which is good, but they were annoyingly hot for the Cody Sammy match.