ANDRADE'S HERE!!!

Jun 5, 2021 2:31:03 GMT CM Punk'd said:

ANDRADE'S HERE!!!

With Vickie as manager, not sure about the pairing. Why can't he just go solo without a manager? I thought he and the people who vouch for him say he can connect with the audience?

Jun 5, 2021 2:33:43 GMT Blindy said:

Jun 5, 2021 2:31:03 GMT CM Punk'd said:

ANDRADE'S HERE!!!

With Vickie as manager, not sure about the pairing. Why can't he just go solo without a manager? I thought he and the people who vouch for him say he can connect with the audience?

Vickie needs something to do and Andrade isn't a very good talker despite what people say about him.

Surely there's someone better on the roster than Vickie Guerrero. It just becomes a massive joke listening to her.

Why did Dustin Rhodes go over a future prospect like Nick Comarato?

Why is it that QT Marshall is the guy who looks like a million bucks in his faction and the other 3 are just losers.

4 VPs and a billionaire's son is why.

Jun 5, 2021 3:59:39 GMT Blindy said:

Why did Dustin Rhodes go over a future prospect like Nick Comarato?

Why is it that QT Marshall is the guy who looks like a million bucks in his faction and the other 3 are just losers.

I don't understand it either. Cody et al are actively dragging down the mid card. It's fucked up.

Cody is trying to elevate QT to his level. He isn't that focus on putting over the boxer, the caveman, or bailey's ex.

JR really just doesn't even pretend to care. That pin was shotty and so was the save. Cody kick out of QTs finish because Lee was late on the breaking.

Or the this guy is really good what is his name.

Cody got pinned after being knocked out by Ogogo. Why are we complaining? I don't get it. Yeah they botched the Diamond Cutter near fall but that wasn't Cody's fault.

Not much of a show really, but that's fine, it's the cooldown after PPV.

I don't see them trying very hard at these late Friday night shows. Friday is already one of the worst nights for TV and then you put it at this timeslot. It's just not going to get them any kind of rating. The move to TBS can't be soon enough. They're out their timeslot all month.

Jun 5, 2021 10:57:14 GMT Emperor said:

Cody got pinned after being knocked out by Ogogo. Why are we complaining? I don't get it. Yeah they botched the Diamond Cutter near fall but that wasn't Cody's fault.

Not much of a show really, but that's fine, it's the cooldown after PPV.

We were talking about Dustin's match.

I thought Cody/Factory had a good match.

There's a part of my mind that drifts off and goes 'how did PAC go from an AEW Championship match straight into a match with the tag team champions?' but that's actually one of the cool parts of AEW. It's a Pro Wrestling company the whole point is just to book awesome matches that fans want to see and some version of the Bucks vs. Penta and PAC is going to appeal to that audience. I also like this version of the Bucks where they can get heat for their double team spots and have their own version of Fonzy to help bounce off of. Not only did we get an entertaining opener out of it, we also got more out of the Kazarian Elite Hunter sub-plot and we got to see where Eddie Kingston landed after they shelved Moxley so he could go and be a father for a bit. Not only do we get to see Eddie's rivalry with the Bucks blossom we also get to see him interact with his old stablemates which makes for a really fun dynamic.

The Mark Henry segment was fine and he's still such a well spoken guy. I think he fits in right with the AEW family. I know some people really can't stand Vickie as an on-screen character but the Guerrero family obviously means a lot and she's a sweetheart. Andrade is going to take a few weeks to get going so having Vickie there just to give him some sort of support and connection with the show is fine. It didn't really occur to me just how crazy Vickie's career in WWE was. She was basically a single mother with no qualifications who took the chance with the WWE and somehow became one of the biggest stars in the company. Imagine if one day your mum just became a WWE star, it's just unfathamoble.

I had a completely different interpretation of the QT Marshall victory. If anything they established Ogogo as a blue chip prospect who has a genuine move that can take out even one of the biggest stars in the company in Cody. Meanwhile QT is just the loudmouth figurehead who takes all the glory, so when these guys eventually go their seperate ways there's the point of contention. Not only did Ogogo get a chance to shine, but so did Lee Johnson who is quickly establishing himself as a genuine prospect in the company and somebody who could easily float around that TNT/Tag Team picture.

There's also this talk about the number of characters on the show and how difficult it is to follow for a new audience. The thing is, they've got so much television and freedom to feature these characters. The point isn't to watch everything and like everything, it's a buffet and they're giving you these guys and girls to follow. If they get over, they'll push them no questions asked. So Cody is using his time slot to get guys like Aaron Solow, Anthony Ogogo, Lee Johnson, Colten Gunn, Nick Comoroto and even Jade Cargill time.

I mean just look at Orange Cassidy. He was the biggest joke character in the first ever official AEW match and now he has a fair claim to an AEW Championship match.

The Inner Circle promo was fine and I thought they did a reasonable job of explaining why the Pinnacle feud needs to continue. I just think back to when AEW was first being discussed in late 2018 and this idea of an MJF/Jericho program that lasts a year sounds like a no-brainer and we're just living that right now. There was a part of me that would have liked the Pinnacle for just a couple of weeks to break out of that feud and just outline their plans to become the most dominant faction in AEW because right now it does feel a little like the Sinister Six in Spiderman that only exists for one reason which seems like a waste to me. My dream feud after this is a Nightmare Family/Pinnacle feud with the Factory getting involved in some capacity.

Christian/Jungle Boy vs. Private Party may have been the most AEW match of all-time. By that I mean it was largely a showcase for younger talent, but you also had that old school dynamic with Matt/Christian. I thought it was a fun way to give Jungle Boy a win but also push Christian into a rivalry with Matt Hardy which is a no-brainer and opens up so many possibilities. I like that they're taking their time with Christian, it would have been so easy to just put him and Kenny together and they'd have good matches together but it'd be difficult to form a connection. If he has the match he's just another selfish old guy coming in for a payday which seems like the opposite of AEW. This gradual build is more intriguing and there's obviously more history here between Matt/Christian.

The Darby segment was fine, Scorpio Sky continues to remind everyone how under-pushed he was. Which is odd to say because they clearly valued him enough to be the inaugural tag team champions when they're establishing the tag team division as a big deal but his 2020 was really disappointing. He was so smooth on the microphone and I think he and Ethan Page are starting to find their footing. I'm really curious to see who Darby alligns himself with, does Lio Rush become his tag team partner?

Kind of a shame they did the Britt Baker and Inner Circle segments on the same night, that felt a little repetitive. Fortunately Britt is one of the best personalities in Pro Wrestling right now and the whole burger deal was great. Also just an easy way to get to set up Nyla Rose/Britt Baker as a heel/heel match. I'm also getting the impression or at least a hint of Britt turning babyface. It will be a slow burn type of deal but the deal with Tony and now Nyla just gives me that impression.

Also it was nice to see Red Velvet win on the main show. She's somebody with a tremendous amount of charisma and I like that group she's got going with Big Swole and Kilynn King. It feels like a good use of Swole who has the right attitude for Pro Wrestling and comes off as a bad-ass butis a little sloppy in parts while King is still just getting established. I've always had time for Allie as well so it's nice to see her get some continuity after a really muddled run so far.

It's good to see Dustin Rhodes still killing it. Comoroto is still obviously raw in some areas, but I thought they laid out a fairly effective match and I think both guys benefited. Dustin as the ring savvy vet who used his knowledge of the gimmick to his advantage while Comoroto just man-handled him in places. It was like what I was saying earlier about the need to introduce all these new characters but also putting them into positions where they matter. If this was just a second of the match card we'd just forget about it. As a main event it may not look great in the moment but in a year or two time it could be a significant part of Nick's development.

Ogogo's stock is plummeted after what happened Sunday by him losing clean to Cody. Had he won that, as he should have, his punch that popped Cody would have been more revered. Instead he comes off as a goon or henchman for QT and this is QT as the mentor, leader & top talent of the Factory stable with the others as goons. Solow hangs out in the ring on the TV shows taking bumps and interfereing and Comoroto prior to yesterday played the Wardlow part of looking big. And he lost, was bloodied up and kicked out of 1 2 minutes prior to eating a 3 count in the main event vs a mid 50's year old guy who has lost more matches than won on Dyanmite, even if Dustin is a long time vet.

QT is the workhorse and reliable guy of the group and is the forefront figure despite getting his ass kicked by Cody weeks ago in a 1 on 1 match.

Ogogo should have won Sunday and kept his "Cody killer' mantra hot, he'd be the kryptonite to Rhodes that QT has in his back pocket. Instead, Cody beat him clean and took his best punch and still got up.

This is the equivalent of having MVP get a midcard run as the top gun of The Hurt Business with Lashley doing the dirty work for MVP and Benjamin & Alexander when they were around to hover outside and be around for promos with occasional wrestling here and there. 

Ogogo's stock wasn't that high to begin with. He's basically a Natural Born Thriller who only ever meant anything in the industry because of Cody. So far this whole experience has been a net gain for Ogogo and the result on Dynamite was a reminder that he's here to stay.

Dustin Rhodes has been treated like he always should have been, a legitimate great, and so far he's been a gate-keeper in singles contests with a .500 record. You maybe a genius Blindy, but I had time on my hands so nerrr. Comoroto went all Streets of Rage throwing guys like Del Fuego around and lost because Dustin Rhodes had to stoop to low blows and all sorts of heel tactics to get the better of him. Again it wasn't like Comoroto was Goldberg, he's been beaten on Dynamite in the past but he's always looked strong in defeat and Dynamite was no different.

That's one issue fans have. They want to rocket strap everyone who has a slither of momentum. It'd be like having John Cena put The Miz over in 2009 even though the story called for Cena to always go over. Or conversley when Cena did put Sheamus over and then nobody cared because there was nowhere else to go with that character at that time. Batista/Cena was way more appealing than whatever direction they went with Sheamus (vs. HHH? that really felt like the Batista/Umaga of that card). With Ogogo if he beats Cody, where is the next obvious direction? Especially since there is still so much more they can do with the Cody story and they can flesh out Ogogo's character.

Jun 5, 2021 17:50:18 GMT Big Pete said:

Ogogo's stock wasn't that high to begin with. He's basically a Natural Born Thriller who only ever meant anything in the industry because of Cody. So far this whole experience has been a net gain for Ogogo and the result on Dynamite was a reminder that he's here to stay.

Dustin Rhodes has been treated like he always should have been, a legitimate great, and so far he's been a gate-keeper in singles contests with a .500 record. You maybe a genius Blindy, but I had time on my hands so nerrr. Comoroto went all Streets of Rage throwing guys like Del Fuego around and lost because Dustin Rhodes had to stoop to low blows and all sorts of heel tactics to get the better of him. Again it wasn't like Comoroto was Goldberg, he's been beaten on Dynamite in the past but he's always looked strong in defeat and Dynamite was no different.

That's one issue fans have. They want to rocket strap everyone who has a slither of momentum. It'd be like having John Cena put The Miz over in 2009 even though the story called for Cena to always go over. Or conversley when Cena did put Sheamus over and then nobody cared because there was nowhere else to go with that character at that time. Batista/Cena was way more appealing than whatever direction they went with Sheamus (vs. HHH? that really felt like the Batista/Umaga of that card). With Ogogo if he beats Cody, where is the next obvious direction? Especially since there is still so much more they can do with the Cody story and they can flesh out Ogogo's character.

It's been a great experience and confidence boost for the wrestler himself but for the character, he squashed like two guys and lost his match with Cody on PPV and was reverted back to a pseudo enforcer for QT. He should have been protected more IMO. Especially if Cody is going on paternity leave. 

Ogogo will be fed with Jake Hager late summer and get his ass fed to him in some knockoff Fight Pit when the inevitable Factory vs Inner Circle feud happens. Jericho will be touring with Fozzy whenever full fledged so I assume QT's camp injures or poisons Jericho and takes him completely off TV, leaving QT vs Sammy, Ogogo vs Hager and Comoroto & Solow vs P&P. Them propping Guevara as the reason they downed Pinnacle makes me think Sammy becomes the leader of Inner Circle while Jericho's away.

So that's who the masked guy was in the stands Who was that next to him? Boy George in the audience? Jim Stephanie Sterling? 

Dustin Rhodes should be treated the same way Mr Ass is, a tall, well-known figure to the audience getting some offense in but ultimately having father time catch up to them in the match vs the younger, borderline hungrier talent who needs the rub to tell the audience he just took down a legend. Yeah he got spanked by Moxley months ago but he's been repackaged as this well-tamed bull by QT and borderline Frankenstein creation and he lost to a mid 50's guy who hadn't won a big match maybe ever on AEW. 

Cena was still in his prime in 2009 and was the face of the company while Miz just escaped WWECW and broke off from Morrison to do a solo act. And face Sheamus was botched because he had no personality and IIRC the heels on the show didn't clash well with the full fledged Irish goodguy act Sheamus was doing. That and smarks knew he was hotshotted because of his relationship with Trips at that time. 

Jun 6, 2021 14:57:07 GMT Blindy said:

Jun 5, 2021 17:50:18 GMT Big Pete said:

Ogogo's stock wasn't that high to begin with. He's basically a Natural Born Thriller who only ever meant anything in the industry because of Cody. So far this whole experience has been a net gain for Ogogo and the result on Dynamite was a reminder that he's here to stay.

Dustin Rhodes has been treated like he always should have been, a legitimate great, and so far he's been a gate-keeper in singles contests with a .500 record. You maybe a genius Blindy, but I had time on my hands so nerrr. Comoroto went all Streets of Rage throwing guys like Del Fuego around and lost because Dustin Rhodes had to stoop to low blows and all sorts of heel tactics to get the better of him. Again it wasn't like Comoroto was Goldberg, he's been beaten on Dynamite in the past but he's always looked strong in defeat and Dynamite was no different.

That's one issue fans have. They want to rocket strap everyone who has a slither of momentum. It'd be like having John Cena put The Miz over in 2009 even though the story called for Cena to always go over. Or conversley when Cena did put Sheamus over and then nobody cared because there was nowhere else to go with that character at that time. Batista/Cena was way more appealing than whatever direction they went with Sheamus (vs. HHH? that really felt like the Batista/Umaga of that card). With Ogogo if he beats Cody, where is the next obvious direction? Especially since there is still so much more they can do with the Cody story and they can flesh out Ogogo's character.

It's been a great experience and confidence boost for the wrestler himself but for the character, he squashed like two guys and lost his match with Cody on PPV and was reverted back to a pseudo enforcer for QT. He should have been protected more IMO. Especially if Cody is going on paternity leave. 

Ogogo will be fed with Jake Hager late summer and get his ass fed to him in some knockoff Fight Pit when the inevitable Factory vs Inner Circle feud happens. Jericho will be touring with Fozzy whenever full fledged so I assume QT's camp injures or poisons Jericho and takes him completely off TV, leaving QT vs Sammy, Ogogo vs Hager and Comoroto & Solow vs P&P. Them propping Guevara as the reason they downed Pinnacle makes me think Sammy becomes the leader of Inner Circle while Jericho's away.

So that's who the masked guy was in the stands Who was that next to him? Boy George in the audience? Jim Stephanie Sterling? 

Dustin Rhodes should be treated the same way Mr Ass is, a tall, well-known figure to the audience getting some offense in but ultimately having father time catch up to them in the match vs the younger, borderline hungrier talent who needs the rub to tell the audience he just took down a legend. Yeah he got spanked by Moxley months ago but he's been repackaged as this well-tamed bull by QT and borderline Frankenstein creation and he lost to a mid 50's guy who hadn't won a big match maybe ever on AEW. 

Cena was still in his prime in 2009 and was the face of the company while Miz just escaped WWECW and broke off from Morrison to do a solo act. And face Sheamus was botched because he had no personality and IIRC the heels on the show didn't clash well with the full fledged Irish goodguy act Sheamus was doing. That and smarks knew he was hotshotted because of his relationship with Trips at that time. 

The way that I look at it, Ogogo is like a Natural Born Thriller. In case you (or somebody else) don't know, that was the name of the WCW Powerplant Faction from WCW that picked fights with all the vets in the company. They weren't pushed to the moon right away, but they worked as underlings and slowly but surely started getting over to the point where Sean O'Haire was considered a future WCW Champion (somehow outside of vignettes this never translated in WWE). We're still super early in Ogogo's career and while he's been super impressive on commentary on Dark, in the ring he's still clearly green so having him lose basically due to a lack of experience more than anything else against Cody Rhodes who is one of the faces in the company seems fitting to me. I mean, the nationalist promo from Cody didn't do it for me so I get the backlash there but in AEW terms he's a major player and he's clearly modeled parts of himself on Cena (The TNT Open Challenge being the most obvious).

I thought they protected Ogogo through out the match. It wasn't like Cody just beat him, Ogogo knocked Rhodes loopy and would have had a pinfall if Cody didn't happen to fall underneath a bottom rope. The finish basically saw Cody catch Ogogo out with a desperation move. To me it was like the Mir/Lesnar fight where Lesnar was clearly the better fighter, but Mir got the hold on at the right time.

I don't think his character underwent any change in the past how many days it was. He was always QT's guy and again they made it clear that he was the real difference maker in that tag team bout. He was featured, while QT got the bragging rights. It was like the Green Hornet rub where Kato did all the hard work.

I only knew it was Fuego because Excalibur pointed it out. The wrestler you're talking about is actually a Nightmare Factory trainee Dilon McQueen who is an openly gay wrestler. He's worked Dark a couple of times and he's OK, a little green as you'd expect but he has some personality.

Dustin has been pretty successful on the major shows. I had him at .500 when I tallied up all the Dynamite and PPV matches as a single so he's clearly being portrayed as a credible mid-card guy. Maybe if he worked like an aging old vet but truth be told he's as good now as he's ever been and he's arguably better than Jericho. Again, I didn't have an issue because they made it pretty clear Dustin only won because of the gimmick and how crafty he was. Comoroto got to look strong but he's not being shoved down anyone's throat or being pushed before his time.

I just think everybody gets scared that things will turn out like WCW, although I really don't think it was about 'pushing new stars' and more the storylines they pushed were rancid. AEW is pushing enough fresh talent they just have to avoid staging storylines like the Warrior nonsense or Ric Flair faking a heart-attack.

Agreed completely with Big Pete.

AEW isn't WWE, or WCW, and we should stop treating AEW like every decision they make is exactly the same as if that decision were made by WWE or WCW. Ogogo isn't buried or ruined forever because he lost one match to one of the strongest booked guys in the company. Comoroto isn't buried or ruined forever because he lost to Dustin Rhodes.

Frankly, I didn't even know who Comoroto was before the Dustin match, and Ogogo was very impressive in his match agaisnt Cody even in defeat. That's a clear net gain for both guys. If you are able to spin that to claim that Cody and his stable are burying everyone, you already made up your mind about Cody and his stable a long time ago and nothing's gonna change that.