Ed wrote a very sweet post, but my inner CM Punk couldn't help but hyper-focus on the sheer disrespect levelled against the wrestling god John Bradshaw Layfield.

So at the risk of beating a dead horse, what direction should the WWE have gone?

Let me lay my cards out on the table.

When JBL won the title I was baffled as anyone else. I watched Bradshaw face off against Scott Hall at Backlash 2002 in the battle of the fall-away slams, he didn't impress me then and a haircut wasn't going to impress me two years down the road. The WWE Championship was already having a credibility problem. On consecutive PPVs we had Hardcore Holly & Eddie Guerrero challenge for the title. Who was next? D'Lo Brown? Al Snow? Was the Big Valbowski going to get a shot? Was Saturn going to return? Sure, Eddie had slowly but surely won me over, but I needed more than fluke wins over Kurt and Brock to buy into him.

To see him fall at the first hurdle to JBL was infuriating and while I thought maybe it was a transitional reign to get the belt on Taker, we were well into 2005 when JBL finally drop the title to John Cena. At a time where 20+ different world champions wasn't uncommon, this felt like an eternity and it wasn't like John Cena was molten hot as Stone Cold Steve Austin. He was the epitome of that generation, a mere replica of what came before, but perfectly marketable to the 7-12 boys demographic.

In hindsight, I recognise that the WWE was going through a serious rebuild. Brock was meant to be their future and he bailed the first opportunity he got. Kurt & Show were out, Taker had just returned as a babyface, Eddie wasn't coping as champion and guys like Mordecai, Rene Dupree, Kenzo Suzuki & Luther Reigns didn't pan out as expected. JBL was good on the mic, he stepped it up in the ring and he actually got some mileage out of Orlando Jordan & The Bashams - a rasslin miracle.

So I ask the question again, if you were in charge of the WWE machine circa 2004 and had to appeal to the same demographics who do you push? How does the title get to John Cena?

Let's start it from the top.

Nothing would have changed if you made The Undertaker a champion. He was pushed as the biggest star on the brand, his angles received plenty of time and he main evented several PPVs. If you didn't like this era, chances were because of The Undertaker and him being champion takes away from the rest of the show.

I'm just not seeing it with Booker T. He got there eventually, but the WWE had well and truly established him as a US Championship guy. He was getting opportunities on the SmackDown brand, but his whole character was that he felt over-looked and he was going to seize the opportunity to make himself a star on SmackDown. I don't think he ran a strong campaign.

RVD was one guy who deserved better. I honestly don't remember him speaking at all on SmackDown and he just seemed to be the rent-a-buddy on SmackDown. I don't think he was in a position to be rocket-strapped, but if you put him in feature matches with Rey Mysterio, Hardcore Holly, Chavo Guerrero, Paul London, Akio, Charlie Haas etc. before graduating to Eddie Guerrero, Kurt Angle etc. it could have been a nice continuation of that SmackDown Six era and pushing Smackdown as the sports show.

There was an easy rivalry there for Mordecai with Eddie. Eddie was a sinner with his lie, cheat, steal philosophy and Mordecai was going to absolve him of his belt. He does so, he beats the Deadman before getting beaten by Hustle, Loyalty and Respect. Mordecai actually has a decent case, if only he had any sense of direction. See the Marky D video if you want a recollection.

Kurt would have been a safe choice. Let's say Eddie just kept it warm, Angle wins it, defends against Big Show and goes through Booker T & Rob Van Dam before dropping it to Cena in a full circle moment. The only down-side is that you don't get HBK/Kurt from WM XXI.

I guess the question is, what matches did you want to see out of that SmackDown roster? Should we have got Eddie Guerrero vs. Mordecai at SummerSlam 2004?

To answer your last question... yes. Wasn't a big reason was that Eddy wasn't handling the pressure well? So I guess it really has to happen around the same time. That said imagine HBK Eddy...

I always wondered whether the WWE was covering up a potential relapse? Because the title change itself was so bizarre and the WWE were really open about throwing Eddie under the bus.

With the caveat that THIS IS STRICTLY AN INTELLECTUAL EXERCISE BECAUSE THE WRESTLING GOD IS IRREPLACEABLE I will play along...

-Agree with Pete on Undertaker being out. Slightly different reasons tho. Here it's because I don't want face Taker beating face Eddie. (I know they tried turning Taker heel with that awful Paul Bearer storyline, but the fans rejected it- he never stopped being cheered) Hate the idea of a wrestler being "bigger than the belt," but if it applies to anyone during the 90s-00s, that person is Taker.

-Angle is out because....he was out in real life. He was on the shelf from Mania-Summerslam iirc. Plus Eddie just beat him at Mania. Then you get into "been there, done that" aspect of Angle as champ. Yet a big part of me likes the idea of Angle as champ just because it means we could finally get that lengthy "Best In The World" style run I always wanted him to have. If you do some tweaking and pretend the injuries don't happen....I don't hate this choice. But let's keep digging for the fun of it...

-Booker T, and the booking thereof, was ice cold from WM 19-Late 2005. If he was having his 01-02 run or 05-06 run in 2004 then he'd be an easy choice. But Book wasn't really setting the world on fire during that era as either a face or a heel. Pass.

-Didn't even consider RVD until Pete brought him up. Unfortunately that's because he's Booker 2.0. 2004 RVD was just going through the motions. Plus he's a hard guy to get over as a heel which you'd have to do if he's going over Eddie.

-Big Show? Big no. He was probably even colder than Booker & RVD. The one thing he does have over Rob is an ability to get heat which you want in an Eddie Guerrero opponent. But 9 months of Show as champ would be brutal. 2004 ain't 1996.

-Kane? Hate to say it, but he probably was hotter than Book, RVD, and Show at the time, and he could generate some heat, but at the end of the day he's still 2004 Kane. Meaning no sane person could possibly want to see him as WWE Champion for 9 days, let alone 9 months.

-How about Jericho? You'd have to tweak some things. Can't have him get screwed over by Trish/Christian at Mania 20 and would have to find a way of getting him to Smackdown, but a change of scenery and a heel turn could be just what the doctor ordered for 2004 Y2J. I think he's the best choice yet other than fantasy world Angle.

-Christian? Nah. He wasn't there yet. Iirc it wasn't until late 2004 that he started getting over as a big time internet cult favorite. Too early. Too risky.

-Edge- You'd have to tweak a lot. He had just come back as a babyface. Would be another gamble....another gamble I wouldn't make.

Verdict- Angle and Jericho are the least bad choices to replace JBL. Actually leaning Y2J because there's less you'd have to tweak/will into existence.

May 12, 2023 15:39:16 GMT Big Pete said:

Should we have got Eddie Guerrero vs. Mordecai at SummerSlam 2004?

YES! But Mordecai must go over.  Ya gotta build to his epic clash with Taker. Only question is when- Survivor Series? Royal Rumble? Or do you go full WM 14 with the long, epic build and Mordecai as Kane 2.0? Oh yeah. That's what you do. Taker/Mordecai @ 21= All. The. Dimes. 

Jericho is the answer. I don't think he had done so yet, but Jericho's entire thing became reinventing himself into a new heel character. All you need is the the most basic motive to set things in motion and Jericho could showcase an entire new persona, an entire new way of speaking, this is literally his greatest attribute. Jericho could even become a Wall Street Asshole, if he really wanted to, more Gordon Gekko than JBL's JR Ewing. Honestly, this would have rocked. 

I wanted to do a second dark horse (a TNA defection of some kind?), but the pickings really are slim. It actually makes JBL make (slightly) more sense, like, fuck it, what else are you going to do?

May 12, 2023 22:42:49 GMT Kilgore said:

Jericho is the answer. I don't think he had done so yet, but Jericho's entire thing became reinventing himself into a new heel character. All you need is the the most basic motive to set things in motion and Jericho could showcase an entire new persona, an entire new way of speaking, this is literally his greatest attribute. Jericho could even become a Wall Street Asshole, if he really wanted to, more Gordon Gekko than JBL's JR Ewing. Honestly, this would have rocked. 

I wanted to do a second dark horse (a TNA defection of some kind?), but the pickings really are slim. It actually makes JBL make (slightly) more sense, like, fuck it, what else are you going to do?

I was on the fence, leaning Jericho before. Kilgore just sold me all the way on Y2J. Especially with the bolded part.

As for a TNA defection, the thought of slipping in a jokey Jeff Jarrett paragraph did cross my mind. I mean "if not JBL..." is already a jokey topic (which Pete himself hinted at). Might as well go all the way with it. 

Jericho did actually cross my mind the other day when we were talking about him and this time period over in the Curse of Jericho thread. My issue is that it's a combination of Kurt Angle's 'been there done that' and Booker T's sheer lack of momentum. In fairness, Jericho had more going for him around that time than Booker. The Jericho/Christian/Trish love triangle was a featured feud, you could have easily made Jericho into a bitter friend trying to nestle up against Eddie only to betray him like he himself was betrayed him and leaned into him being this sex, drugs and rock n roll character. So instead of ripping off JBL, I think he'd be better off ripping off Edge and you could even bring Chavo back into it with him and some of the other Guerreros endorsing Jericho.

Besides, in 2004 I didn't see Jericho as a corporate guy. I bought into it more when he started defending the WWE during the Benoit tragedy and after Jericho watched No Country For Old Men but Jericho was still pushing Fozzy hard. JBL was more of an extension of that guy, so I'd rather guys lean into those roles. Even at the time, I didn't have a problem with the gimmick, it was the push that completely floored me.

My gripe is that after his 2001-02 run, no one was clamoring for another Jericho title run. It was a disastrous run and Jericho seemed to be firmly planted as that upper-mid card guy. A brand change may have rejuvenated his career somewhat, but I think the best thing was for him to go away two years, come back with a new look, finisher and have that extended program with HBK.