I feel like Todd & NATH45 should write a dirt sheet together

The numbers are in, AEW Winter is Coming reportedly garnered 948,000 viewers. Up 7% on last week. 

That's good. 


And 0.31 in the 18-49 demo - which is actually 7% down on last week. 

That's bad. 


RAW, awful, awful RAW did 1.574 million viewers. Down on the previous week. 

That's good. 


But what about the demo? Well, RAW did 0.39% in the 18-49 demo. Up over 11% on the previous week. WWE won the demo.

That's bad. 

The social media guy WWE needs.

If you come for the king, you better not miss. TK is packing heat, Fox news cannot handle that key demo, brother.

All I see is more people watching Moonshiners.

Alright I fuck with Cora Jade/Elayna Black now, she may be only 21 but she backs down from no one:

biggoldbelt.com/news/joey-janela-fires-back-at-alleged-disrespect-from-indie-star-elayna-black/

An absolute legendary 2021 she is having, she started by pwning the fuck out of Jelly Janela who got so butthurt he demanded GCW to never book her again and said she got as far as she has because of her boyfriend Blake Christian formerly Baxter of NXT.

Got signed immediately to WWE soon afterwards to avoid potential toxicity in AEW, gets on TV weekly not long after signing and got the winning pin in the big Wargames PPV.

Her way to end the year: Absolutely destroy Darby Allin who randomly shit on her for calling her a poser for TV. She will live with the evil eye from Priscilla Kelly/Gigi Dolin most likely in the Toxic Attraction/Cora feud given despite breaking up, Allin & Dolin are still friends but man what balls this girl has.



Who the fuck does Allin think he is? Dude was the anti-toxic guy and was trying to be cool like Jeff Hardy but then goes and says shit like this to someone who has done nothing. He didn't even create the skating gimmick in wrestling.

I love watching Darby wrestle but, come on bro. Multiple people can be influenced by something.

Dec 18, 2021 1:04:14 GMT NATH45 said:

All I see is more people watching Moonshiners.

Just when I wanted to give Big Pete props for out-NATH45'ing @admin, NATH45 immediately reestablishes that there is only one true king.

Also, if Big Pete is gonna be referencing The Wire in here, can we at least get the thread title edited to "Wrestling War (Dirt)sheeeeeeeet Talk Thread"?

Tony Khan mocking Fox News for Succession whilst literally being the entitled son of a billionaire is a lack of self awareness I wasn’t quite ready for this morning.

Dec 18, 2021 1:20:52 GMT Blindy said:

Alright I fuck with Cora Jade/Elayna Black now, she may be only 21 but she backs down from no one:

biggoldbelt.com/news/joey-janela-fires-back-at-alleged-disrespect-from-indie-star-elayna-black/

An absolute legendary 2021 she is having, she started by pwning the fuck out of Jelly Janela who got so butthurt he demanded GCW to never book her again and said she got as far as she has because of her boyfriend Blake Christian formerly Baxter of NXT.

Got signed immediately to WWE soon afterwards to avoid potential toxicity in AEW, gets on TV weekly not long after signing and got the winning pin in the big Wargames PPV.

Her way to end the year: Absolutely destroy Darby Allin who randomly shit on her for calling her a poser for TV. She will live with the evil eye from Priscilla Kelly/Gigi Dolin most likely in the Toxic Attraction/Cora feud given despite breaking up, Allin & Dolin are still friends but man what balls this girl has.



Who the fuck does Allin think he is? Dude was the anti-toxic guy and was trying to be cool like Jeff Hardy but then goes and says shit like this to someone who has done nothing. He didn't even create the skating gimmick in wrestling.

That is a good come back by Cora Jade. But she doesn't seem like a skater. She looks awkward like she just learn enough for the gimmick. I remember saying that about her when I first saw her too.

Dec 18, 2021 12:36:42 GMT X-zero said:

Dec 18, 2021 1:20:52 GMT Blindy said:

Alright I fuck with Cora Jade/Elayna Black now, she may be only 21 but she backs down from no one:

biggoldbelt.com/news/joey-janela-fires-back-at-alleged-disrespect-from-indie-star-elayna-black/

An absolute legendary 2021 she is having, she started by pwning the fuck out of Jelly Janela who got so butthurt he demanded GCW to never book her again and said she got as far as she has because of her boyfriend Blake Christian formerly Baxter of NXT.

Got signed immediately to WWE soon afterwards to avoid potential toxicity in AEW, gets on TV weekly not long after signing and got the winning pin in the big Wargames PPV.

Her way to end the year: Absolutely destroy Darby Allin who randomly shit on her for calling her a poser for TV. She will live with the evil eye from Priscilla Kelly/Gigi Dolin most likely in the Toxic Attraction/Cora feud given despite breaking up, Allin & Dolin are still friends but man what balls this girl has.



Who the fuck does Allin think he is? Dude was the anti-toxic guy and was trying to be cool like Jeff Hardy but then goes and says shit like this to someone who has done nothing. He didn't even create the skating gimmick in wrestling.

That is a good come back by Cora Jade. But she doesn't seem like a skater. She looks awkward like she just learn enough for the gimmick. I remember saying that about her when I first saw her too.

I agree but she probably didn't get a choice on what to be, she probably wanted to hit that "Skater chick" character to get TV time on AEW but I assume she would do her tarot cards/witchcraft inspired gimmick if she wasn't on a PG/TV 14 show. Just seems lame for Allin to take a shot here unless they never got along going back to the Indies or AEW. 

I feel like Alvarez is responsible for this.

Alvarez isnt wrong is he?

Dec 18, 2021 16:51:22 GMT nazzer said:

Alvarez isnt wrong is he?

His whole premise is flawed (is Abadon really a zombie? why is there a guy that pretends to be a dinosaur?) but I just wanted to provide some context behind what fuelled this.

Dec 18, 2021 17:13:14 GMT Big Pete said:

Dec 18, 2021 16:51:22 GMT nazzer said:

Alvarez isnt wrong is he?

His whole premise is flawed (is Abadon really a zombie? why is there a guy that pretends to be a dinosaur?) but I just wanted to provide some context behind what fuelled this.

Wait a sec, Abadon isn't really a zombie?

I feel the change in general character presentation on nxt is difficult because of just how much a dramatic change it has been since 2.0. 

Dec 18, 2021 17:13:14 GMT Big Pete said:

Dec 18, 2021 16:51:22 GMT nazzer said:

Alvarez isnt wrong is he?

His whole premise is flawed (is Abadon really a zombie? why is there a guy that pretends to be a dinosaur?) but I just wanted to provide some context behind what fuelled this.

The random person on twitter was complimenting both Allin and Jade though and Allin went out of his way to say that his is a lifestyle and not an impersonation, I never understood this elitism attitude by skaters and the like. 

That's like saying a "casual" fighting game fan who button mashes goes up against an "expert" FGC/fighting game fans and the latter dismisses the former's ability. Or a Dark Souls diehard fan making fun of someone who is struggling mightily at the game. Just comes off as prickish and arrogant. 

BTW Bryan Alvarez doesn't have any right to be as much of a jerk as he's been with this golden egg:

Dec 18, 2021 20:29:58 GMT Blindy said:

Dec 18, 2021 17:13:14 GMT Big Pete said:

His whole premise is flawed (is Abadon really a zombie? why is there a guy that pretends to be a dinosaur?) but I just wanted to provide some context behind what fuelled this.

The random person on twitter was complimenting both Allin and Jade though and Allin went out of his way to say that his is a lifestyle and not an impersonation, I never understood this elitism attitude by skaters and the like. 

That's like saying a "casual" fighting game fan who button mashes goes up against an "expert" FGC/fighting game fans and the latter dismisses the former's ability. Or a Dark Souls diehard fan making fun of someone who is struggling mightily at the game. Just comes off as prickish and arrogant. 

Just git gud!!!

God, as a shitty Souls player going back to the old forum days when everyone found Demon Souls, I hate the git gud assholes.  The original Dark Souls release people were so toxic in I just skipped that game entirely.  

I suspect Darby will become a problem sooner or later from his attitude.  We seen this so many times with people that live their gimmicks.  

Will say this about Alvarez, at least he wrestled.  Remember him beating Sweeney for the ICW/ICWA Tex-Arkana Television Title.  Looking at cage match he also fought Nick Gage in CT o.O.

The man is 28 and voluntarily rides a skateboard. At 28.

Sure, Riddle rides a scooter. But the bro is cooked. So that's understandable.

Geeks.

Dweebs.

&

Dorks.

It's exactly as advertised.

The random person on twitter was complimenting both Allin and Jade though

I don't necessarily think it was that comment that illicited the response, but the general conversation around it so Darby cherry picked that one comment to take a shot.

I feel the change in general character presentation on nxt is difficult because of just how much a dramatic change it has been since 2.0.

I think there's been critics who from day one chose to hate on this because it would mean their 'sources' would receive less opportunities and they can't wrap their heads around a developmental brand. So they make these points that help drive the 'us vs. them' mentality that's swept through Pro Wrestling.

Has it been that bad of a shift though?

Quality wise, sure. Comparision to AEW, yes. Developmental wise, it's a good thing.

The biggest notable difference is the lack of The UE and now The Garganos, and of course, the presentation changes. It, and always has promoted young talent, with terrible gimmicks despite an obsession with independent talent.

The danger NXT was always going to find themselves in, is they drew from the independents, they took everyone of notability and now there's no one left. So, the choice is to keep squeezing blood out of a stone and get everything out of these 30-something vets until its dry or build young, new talent from the ground up. Thus the WWE NIL program and guys like Bron.

In saying that, NXT 2.0 still has a very 1.0 roster. Grimes, Imperium, Lumis, Ciampa, Kushida, Kai, Gonzalez, GYV, LDF, Knight, MSK, Dunne, Strong, Thatcher, Indi, Io, etc are very much the core roster still.

And I actually applaud the introduction of TA as its the first time in a long time, we've had women with gimmicks that extend beyond the " women's revolution " core character archetype. Fast tracking Grayson Waller, Bron Brekker and Carmelo Hayes, and maybe to a lesser extent Solo, Gacy, Cora and Wagner wouldn't have been possible in a bloated NXT 1.0 so destined on a continual UE hype train or another 'today in the life of Johnny Wrestling' chapter. ( as much as I loved both )

It should be a valuable lesson for AEW. Invest in new talent, because eventually your friends will get old and the independents will run dry.

NXT would have never bleed the indies dry. People greatly underestimate how many wrestlers there actually are. RoH, PWG, CZW and other feds until the COVID lockdowns had full and diverse rosters. Under them were lesser known territory style feds that were the big indy feds at the state level that get no national recognition. Below them are the school based feds. People are constantly fed up, so that when NXT takes someone, the fed they raided just take a guy from the state level, who then take someone from the schools. There are thousands if not tens of thousands of wrestlers in the US. Plenty of hidden gems mixed all around the US waiting for their shot in a national indy fed.

NIL program is going to be a grinder. They are not going to find many stars. Nor do I expect them to believe this as well. They simply will grab college people for a pittance and bring them to camps. Take the one or two best, then fire them all and take a new batch the next year. Great way to get a generic superstar with the WWE look, but likely absolutely no character at all. Which is so stupid IMO as the moves are not hard to learn, the character work is though. Gonna end up with like dozens of vanilla people praying one of them as a natural gift for drama.

Or its a great way to find exactly what they're looking for = 6'3"+ 250lb+ athletes.

The biggest criticism anyone could have of NXT is it didn't do well enough producing "WWE Superstars" ( see above )

NXT's focus on smaller, more athletic "wrestlers" is the exact opposite of what Vince McMahon is looking for. Famously OVW produced 4 top guys, that have been the pillars of WWE for the last 20 years. And FCW, maybe one real, true "top guy" in Roman Reigns. If NIL is the means to finding the next "guy" then so be it. Because as a developmental system for male main event talent, NXT didn't achieve its goal.

The Horse-Women and maybe, Alexa Bliss are a different story.

More credit should be given to the WWE for its transparency, they want big, strong, young athletes that look a million bucks. Instead of hiring short, skinny independent wrestlers and wasting everyone's time trying to teach old dogs, WWE tricks.

It is good program for all involved, as WWE gets to try out people and the NCAA people start to think about themselves outside of their area, but for wrestling what will likely produce is a group of good looking people who can barely work and are exciting as watching paint dry. Also turnaround time is massive. Figure two years training until they are working matches with a basic character, and another 3 to 5 until they are ready for TV on the main roster. That is crazy to me.

And they are not getting beasts. If this was bring in 20 beasts and see if they can work would be a different story. These guy are more along the lines of Seth Rollins or Baron Corbin than Lashley or Lesner. No one like Lashley or Lesner will take a WWE contract if they are planning to go to the Olympics. Just too risky to do anything but train and wrestle.

Dec 18, 2021 20:29:58 GMT Blindy said:

Dec 18, 2021 17:13:14 GMT Big Pete said:

His whole premise is flawed (is Abadon really a zombie? why is there a guy that pretends to be a dinosaur?) but I just wanted to provide some context behind what fuelled this.

The random person on twitter was complimenting both Allin and Jade though and Allin went out of his way to say that his is a lifestyle and not an impersonation, I never understood this elitism attitude by skaters and the like. 

That's like saying a "casual" fighting game fan who button mashes goes up against an "expert" FGC/fighting game fans and the latter dismisses the former's ability. Or a Dark Souls diehard fan making fun of someone who is struggling mightily at the game. Just comes off as prickish and arrogant. 

Some lifestyles are mixed with elitism behavior so when someone pretends to be one even in wrestling it bothers people who embrace it. Skateboarding is just one of them. Straight Edge is another one remember the thing with Serena Deeb.

As for gaming, with the rise of popular casual games like angry birds, candy crush, and etc. Some gamers didn't like people who play those games calling themselves gamers.

Dec 15, 2021 3:07:58 GMT Blindy said:

Dec 15, 2021 3:05:14 GMT NATH45 said:

We have heels. But noone can commit to be truly an evil bustard anymore.

The last time anyone said anything naughty, they where suspended and had to take sensitivity training. Villains do bad shit, that's what they do. But they can't.

So they go for obnoxiousness. Ie; The Bucks. The Miz, MJF....

On that. If MJF calling Punk, Punky Brewster is the height of heelism in 2021.. God help us all.

The last truly heelish, borderline evil move was when Baron Corbin gave Becky Lynch an End of Days last year or so in the Rollins/Becky vs Lacey Evans/Corbin intergender match.

It'll probably take something of that nature or an assault on a kid(Which will never happen) to truly get the fans hating on them. 

Velveteen Dream if he lasted long enough for the live crowds to be back would have been nuclear though.

I come from the future, the futurrrrrre!

www.wrestlinginc.com/news/2021/12/baron-corbin-says-he-received-death-threats-from-fans-in-2019-after-he-hit-end-of-days-onbecky-lynch/

“When I hit Becky with the End of Days, I was getting death threats,” Corbin said. “On a regular basis. 95% of [critics] are on the internet or safely behind somewhere they can’t be accessed. Roman said it the best one time, that he’s never met a hater in real life. That’s the same kind of thing with me.



“It would be funny if at the airport, all the guys hanging there for autographs were like open your Twitter and let me see if you’re blocked or not to decide if you can get an autograph. It’s funny, it’s the cool thing to do now in life, people just want to drag people down, it makes them feel good but my whole career has been that way with social media but now it’s 10x with the way the world is. You got to have thick skin man.”

Anytime a big guy slams a smaller woman, that is easy peasy heat. I know intergender matches sort of take the wow factor out of it all but when it's done so rarely, it really makes you loathe the heel so much.

Dec 21, 2021 1:36:44 GMT X-zero said:

Dec 18, 2021 20:29:58 GMT Blindy said:

The random person on Twitter was complimenting both Allin and Jade though and Allin went out of his way to say that he is a lifestyle and not an impersonation, I never understood this elitism attitude by skaters and the like. 

That's like saying a "casual" fighting game fan who button mashes goes up against an "expert" FGC/fighting game fan and the latter dismisses the former's ability. Or a Dark Souls diehard fan making fun of someone who is struggling mightily at the game. Just comes off as prick-ish and arrogant. 

Some lifestyles are mixed with elitism behavior so when someone pretends to be one even in wrestling it bothers people who embrace it. Skateboarding is just one of them. Straight Edge is another one remember the thing with Serena Deeb.

As for gaming, with the rise of popular casual games like angry birds, candy crush, etc. Some gamers didn't like people who play those games calling themselves gamers.

Do fans telling Jade she can't skate mean that they are elitists are just pointing out a fact? elitists to me, are folks that think their taste in things is always above others. Fans pointing out something that makes them not believe that the character or persona, especially when it comes to a relatable thing like skating is not saying you have to be the best at it or we won't include you in our community. Just be believable at it.

No fans saying she can't skate isn't elitist. When someone in a group says you don't display or have enough skill to be considered one of them is elitism.