#1 New Age Outlaws- Were tied with LOD atop the tag team countdown standings until the very last voter. Thank goodness for Big Pete. I usually don't get too worked up over these countdowns. This would have been a rare exception. I'd have quit PW forever* if the Outlaws didn't claim their rightful place at #1. They had the most reigns and the most cumulative days as tag champs. Got over as both heels and faces. Were a major part of peak DX. They're also the most over tag team in company history.

NAO are one of the biggest booking successes in WWE history as well. I can't imagine a wrestling fan anywhere on the planet who looked at Rockabilly & the Real Double J and thought "Oh yeah. There's money to be made with these guys." Yet somebody in power saw something in them no one else did, took a chance, and it paid off big time. Hats off to that person.

*Not really

#2 Legion of Doom- An easy choice for #2 despite not logging a ton of time as tag champs due to their star power and longevity. 

#1 Vince McMahon- As I just mentioned in UT's thread I didn't learn Vince owned WWF until about 1994. Before that I just assumed Jack Tunney really was in charge, not that I put much thought into it. Early Vince was just a hyperactive doofus good guy announcer...a Todd Pettengill type with more tv time. Even after I learned he ran the show, he continued to be that dorky babyface commentator in my mind until some time in 1997. If the 90s had ended a day before the Montreal Screwjob Vince likely sneaks on my list just for being the longtime voice of the company. And to his credit, he was really good at getting across the storylines, and putting his pet characters over.

But everybody knows he found his true calling as Mr. McMahon: Bad Guy Boss. It's really one of the more stunning transformations in a business full of stunning transformation. We all know the story by now. Had an epic feud with Austin. Turned WWF business around. Made millions of dollars. Played his role to a tee. As great as Vince was in his role, I could never, ever bring myself to boo him. Dude provided me with thousands of hours of entertainment over the years. He practically was my childhood/young adulthood. Mad respect.

#2 Jim Ross- Best commentator ever. The voice of the Attitude Era. Had great chemistry with Lawler. I think the two most important attributes a wrestling commentator can have are a connection with his audience and the ability to make matches better. WWF fans trusted Ross so we bought what he was selling. He also had the ability to make average matches good, and good matches great through his commentary. We all know his iconic calls by now. The only black mark on Ross's 90s WWF run are his two failed heel turns. But I don't even blame JR for that. He played his role as best he could. It's just that the WWF fans rejected the whole premise of Ross as a bad guy. We didn't want to boo him.

*I want to give Howard Finkel a shout out since The Fink sadly got no votes. The Fink's WCW counterpart, Gary Michael Cappetta, got my vote in the WCW Supplemental Countdown, and I wanted to find room for Finkel on this one, but there just wasn't room for him. Definitely deserves a mention though.

Mean Gene is another who I wish had received a vote. He was sort of the Ross of his day in that WWF fans liked and trusted him.

Earl Hebner is yet another name I considered who got no votes. He's probably the most famous ref in wrestling history and was the 3rd man in the ring for most of your favorite 90s WWF matches. Then again, he was also involved in the Montreal Screwjob. So screw him. Danny Davis was more memorable anyway.

Didn't Hogan main event 6 of the first 7 Wrestlemanias?

Jan 29, 2018 18:39:49 GMT bodyslam said:

Didn't Hogan main event 6 of the first 7 Wrestlemanias?

If you are simply considering main eventing to be appearing in the last originally scheduled match, then he main evented 7 of the first 8 (and Hogan/Andre III was still the main draw for Mania IV, alongside the tournament).

If you are considering main eventing to be appearing in the last match of the evening, then he main evented 8 of the first 9.

If you are considering main eventing to be being part of the most pushed match on the show, then there is an argument that he main evented all of the first 9 (I'd say you could argue that the main draw/event of Mania 9 was "The return of Hulk Hogan" more than specifically his tag match or Bret/Yoko - the same way that the PPV draw for Mania XIV was Mike Tyson featuring Steve Austin really).

Then you consider that Hogan/Rock was clearly the main event of X8 and Hogan/Vince was the most pushed match for XIX (I would like to have seen how that show would've drawn if not for the fact it was the first digital cable Mania and meant that those still with regular cable could not actually order it), it is not far from silly to claim that Hogan's match or Hogan himself was the main draw for the 11 Manias that he wrestled at. He is Mr. WrestleMania.

Wow, I was the high vote for Diesel as my #9 placement. He did play a part in me switching to WCW more on a full time basis but I couldn't ignore his kayfabe accomplishments despite tanking as a draw. Came in as a non-descript bodyguard for HBK but entered the '94 Rumble and mowed down most everyone in his path. Defeated Razor for the IC title and soon got title shots at Bret. I was fine with this build up but they pulled the trigger too quickly on giving him the big strap. Plus he defeated an over the hill Bob Backlund which made his christening that much less impressive. Continued to have good matches with Bret but outside of that from what I could tell he didn't look comfortable as Vince's new golden boy. His off and on relationship with HBK wasn't very appealing and other main event programs with Mabel and Sid fizzeled out. Had a good send-off with solid matches against Undertaker and Shawn to see him out.

I wasn't as high on Randy Savage's 90's work as some. Had a pretty tame 1990 for the most part feuding with Dusty Rhodes in the midcard while also not seeming to be a real threat to Hogan after another high profile loss in the Main Event. Got going again assaulting Ultimate Warrior at SNME and the Royal Rumble, costing Warrior the title. He and Warrior always worked well together having a great cage match at MSG and an all time classic at Wrestlemania which forced Savage into retirement. He got on the fan's good side reuniting with Elizabeth and having a faux marriage at Summerslam. Jake brought a snake in as a gift which ignited Savage's most intense feud of the decade. He was still relegated to commentary while lobbying Jack Tunney to get reinstated. Savage and Jake had an underwhelming blow-off with a match at Tuesday In Texas then a brief brawl at the Royal Rumble. Got back in the title picture with a win over Ric Flair in a memorable match/feud. He wasn't as prominent a champion as his first go around mostly showing up for the odd promo on TV and having Coliseum exlusives in singles/tags with Shawn, Flair and Bret. Had another solid match with Warrior at Summserslam before losing the title back to Flair. Mixed it up with Razor briefly before going back to commentary for the most part. Had one last hurrah with Crush before more commentary then leaving. He had a strong 1991-92 but was still overshadowed by Warrior and Flair for top billing while the rest was languishing in the midcard or on commentary. All this added up to being number 14 on my list.

I was Ultimate Warrior's biggest booster giving him the 7 spot on my list. He came into the 90's on fire, threatening to take Hogan's title and eventually doing so at Wrestlemania VI. WWF should have gone with the monster booking with Warrior to keep him strong but I think they still weren't comfortable with his in-ring work. He was then left to defend against past WWF and IC title retreads Ted DiBiase and Rick Rude while Hogan got the new monster Earthquake to feud with. This booking really didn't indicate a passing of the torch to many so after petering out as champion he lost to Sgt. Slaughter at the '91 Rumble. Got some fire back feuding with Randy Savage, Undertaker and Jake Roberts before his controversial departure after Summerslam where he was getting back into the main event scene. Was as over as ever when he returned at Wrestlemania VIII. In a rebook they should have had Flair defend at Mania against Savage then drop the belt to Warrior at Summerslam. Instead he was mired in a comical feud with Papa Shango. Got his steam back though through his association with Savage and seemed ready for big things again before the steroid investigation got too intense and he was let go. His staying power was showcased once again as is highly anticipated return in 1996 was met with a huge reaction. Soon though he felt out of place in the New Generation and was let go again for missing dates. His iconic title win, Wrestlemania apperances and memorable returns make him one of the definitive stars of the 90's.

I had The Rock just outside of my top 10 in the 11 spot. What hurt him was his lame first year or so as both a failed babyface and heel. Once he was paired with Austin in late 1997 he got his legs under him. He was back in the midcard though by 1998 feuding with Triple H for the IC title and not really becoming a main event player until later in the year. His really strong 1999 boosted his ranking but his inconsistent 1996-1998 cost him the top ten.

Mick Foley however was strong throughout 1996-1999. Memorable Undertaker adversary, getting Triple H some noteworthy matches, interacting with the Rock, Dude Love, making Cactus Jack an MSG star, the Chainsaw Charlie pairing etc. Everything Mick did in the WWF was memorable and entertaining which boosted him to the 6 spot on my list. He was a major character during the WWF's most high profile period, simple as that.

Mostly on the strength of being the WWF flag bearer and still being a pop culture icon going into the 90's Hulk Hogan got the last spot in my top 5. Lost the Ultimate Challenge but still made both Warrior and himself look strong afterword. Had yet another monster feud with Earthquake which, while rehashing his King Kong Bundy feud, still resonated with many due to the vignettes in the aftermath of being squashed. After beating Earthquake he was relied on to save the WWF's house show business and save America from an Iraqi sympathizer Sgt. Slaughter. After another big win at Wreslemania and some smooth sailing and finally encountering Ric Flair his title reign and career got messy in a hot potato feud with the Undertaker and getting into hot water with the steroid scandal. Really didn't improve his standing acting like a spoiled brat at the 1992 Royal Rumble then announcing his retirement after a lackluster match with Sid. Returned to steal Bret Hart's spotlight in 1993 beating Yokozuna in a joke ending to Wrestlemania IX. He also got his buddy Brutus Beefcake back into circulation for some tag team matches with Money Inc. Not long after due to a new TV show and getting tired of the WWF's legal troubles had Hulkamania ended by Yokozuna to repay the favor. 

Being one of the key catalysts of the Attitude Era and having a run as the top face placed Shawn Michaels in my top 3. Yes most of us hated him but along with Bret was the defining in ring performer of the 90's and had many memorable moments that make any WWF highlight reel.

Undertaker's ascension in the 90's speaks or itself. Vince's greatest ever creation laid the foundation for his legendary career right from the get go at Survivor Series 90 right through to the following year beating Hogan. He was a central attraction throughout the decade but was never the face of the company which was the only difference between him and Shawn which resulted in the number 4 spot.



,

For some reason I expected the top 2 to be between Hart and Undertaker with Austin falling to #3. I couldn't tell you why, just a feeling I had.

Makes sense that Austin takes it though. His stardom in the mid to late 90's is unmatched, and we'll never see a 3-4 year run like he had ever again. Sure, guys like Cena and Reigns and whoever they push in the future will have multiple title wins and main event everything, but they will never have the crowd go apeshit like Austin could night in and night out.

Hogan belongs in the top 5, definitely. I think if this is an 80's list, he's #1. But 90's? Yeah, 5 seems right, especially with HBK above him.

Glad Foley finished above The Rock.

Fitting that Bret and Austin were 1 and 2. Bret hand picked Austin to work with and put him over in the best way possible to make him look like a bad ass to send him on his way.

Great job once again Baker for running yet another fine countdown.

My Top 5 mirrored PW's. Good job, folks.

#1 Steve Austin- An obvious winner. Turned WWF business around. Had all time great feuds with Bret & Vince. Arguably the most over wrestler ever. Won everything important there was to win. Was a new kind of top babyface. Has never been duplicated despite the best efforts of WWE and other promotions. Austin basically was the Attitude Era.

#2 Bret Hart- Had longevity, and more good/great matches than anybody else in 90s WWF. Was the standard bearer during WWF's lean years. Had great feuds with Austin, Owen, Lawler & Michaels. Won everything there was to win. Bret (and Shawn) working their way up through the ranks from tag champ to IC champ to finally WWF champ became my ideal from about the mid 90s on. 1997 Bret is maybe my favorite wrestler ever while the infamous Montreal Screwjob is among the most famous matches of all time. The only guy other than Austin I considered for #1 (for about 5 seconds). 

#3 Undertaker- The longevity champion of 90s WWF. Was booked strong from Day One. Settled into his role as WWF's Andre-style special attraction of the 90s. Became just as iconic as his predecessor. Feuded with a lot of freak show monster types, with the Foley & Kane rivalries being the most well known. Was involved in the legendary first two Hell In A Cell's. Also introduced a bunch of other gimmick matches to the company. Won the WWF title multiple times and wrestled all the major players. Was over as both a heel and face. Fwiw would be Top 3 on a 90s WWF Favorites list.

#4 Shawn Michaels- Like Bret, he worked his way up through the ranks. Is behind only "The Hitman" when it comes to good/great matches in 90s WWF. Won practically everything important, including becoming the first Grand Slam champion. Founding father of DX. Like the 3 guys above him, excelled as both a face and a heel. While their styles are very different, I think 1996 Michaels came the closest to Hogan in terms of presentation/(over)push. 

#5 Hulk Hogan- Hulkamania was still going strong as the 90s began. Memorably passed the torch to Warrior a few months later. Warrior fumbled it, so Hogan took it back. Won the WWF title 4 times and main evented 4 Wrestlemania's on the "downside" of his career. WWF remained Hogan's playground. As a young WWF fan, the idea of a WWF without Hogan was unfathomable. Yet it eventually did become a reality. Even away from the company, Hogan had an influence with the many parodies and WWF Magazine's obsession with denigrating Hogan while putting over the latest flavor of the month as the new "Greatest WWF Champion Ever." 

My list

1. Steve Austin (1)
2. Bret Hart (2)
3. Undertaker (3)
4. Shawn Michaels (4)
5. Hulk Hogan (5)
6. Randy Savage (9)
7. The Rock (7)
8. Ultimate Warrior (8)
9. Mick Foley [6]
10. Diesel (10)
11. Razor Ramon (14)
12. HHH (11 tie)
13. Yokozuna (13)
14. Ric Flair (11 tie)
15. Owen Hart (15)
16. British Bulldog (16)
17. X-Pac/Kid (20)
18. Kane (17)
19. Sid (19)
20. Billy Gunn (30)
21. Jake Roberts (25)
22. Mr. Perfect (18)
23. Bossman (29)
24. Road Dogg (31)
25. Jeff Jarrett (22)
26. Goldust (23)
27. Earthquake (33)
28. Road Warrior Hawk (43)
29. Road Warrior Animal (44)
30. Lex Luger (21)
31. Sgt. Slaughter (28)
32. Bob Backlund (41)
33. Ken Shamrock (27)
34. Ted Dibiase (26)
35. IRS (46)
36. Roddy Piper (24)
37. Jacques Rougeau/Mountie (40)
38. Jerry Lawler (36)
39. Tatanka (45)
40. Godfather/Papa Shango (38 tie)
41. Faarooq (42)
42. Bam Bam Bigelow (32)
43. Ahmed Johnson (37)
44. Big Show (35)
45. Vader (34)
46. Val Venis (49)
47. Jim Neidhart (60)
48. Chyna (38 tie)
49. Marty Jannetty (48)
50. Alundra Blayze (47)

Tag Team List

1. New Age Outlaws (1)
2. Legion of Doom (2)
3. Money Inc. (3)
4. Smoking Gunns (8 tie)
5. Owen Hart & British Bulldog [6]
6. Quebecers (5)
7. Hart Foundation (7)
8. Demolition (10)
9. Steiner Brothers (4)
10. Rockers (8 tie)

Supplemental List

1. Vince McMahon (1)
2. Jim Ross (2)
3. Jerry Lawler (3)
4. Sable (5)
5. Bobby Heenan (4)
6. Mr. Perfect (9 tie)
7. Chyna (8)
8. Paul Bearer (9)
9. Jim Cornette [6]
10. Sunny (7)

*Now that we've done 90s WWF, WCW & ECW I figured it would be fun to see which wrestlers made the Top 50 in multiple promotions. Only two men cracked the Top 50 in all three promotions. There's a reason these two are first ballot Hall of Famers, folks.

WWF/WCW/ECW

Mick Foley- 9 WWF/23 WCW/9 ECW
Steve Austin- 1 WWF/28 WCW/40 ECW

WWF & WCW

Hulk Hogan- 5 WWF/3 WCW
Ric Flair- 11 WWF/2 WCW
Randy Savage- 9 WWF/7 WCW
Diesel/Kevin Nash- 10 WWF/9 WCW
Razor Ramon/Scott Hall- 14 WWF/13 WCW
Lex Luger- 21 WWF/8 WCW
Bret Hart- 2 WWF/32 WCW
Vader- 34 WWF/5 WCW
Sid- 19 WWF/30 WCW
Big Show/Giant- 35 WWF/16 WCW
Mr. Perfect/Curt Hennig- 18 WWF/38 WCW
Jeff Jarrett- 22 WWF/40 WCW
Goldust/Dustin Rhodes- 23 WWF/39 WCW
Roddy Piper- 24 WWF/42 WCW
Road Warrior Hawk- 43 WWF/27 WCW
Faarooq/Ron Simmons- 42 WWF/29 WCW
Road Warrior Animal- 44 WWF/27 WCW

WWF & ECW

Bam Bam Bigelow- 32 WWF/17 ECW

WCW & ECW

Raven- 31 WCW/4 ECW
Terry Funk- 33 WCW/5 ECW
Dean Malenko- 20 WCW/26 ECW
Rey Mysterio Jr.- 15 WCW/33 ECW
Eddie Guerrero- 25 WCW/25 ECW
Chris Benoit- 17 WCW/38 ECW
Chris Jericho- 19 WCW/36 ECW
Brian Pillman- 21 WCW/43 ECW
Perry Saturn- 49 WCW/18 ECW

Great lists, guys! Explanations behind choices remind me of how good folks were. Also, it really resonates with me particularly since I’m running a WWE-based HOF on my site that I’m currently accepting nominations for.