Nath, if aew uses the indiea to fill ita roster. What black main eventers from the indys should they sign?

Jonathan Gresham, Keith Lee and Athena are the big three. Gresham may be TNA already though.

Jan 2, 2022 2:22:37 GMT NATH45 said:

It was also reported that AEW's fanbase is 68% white, while WWE's is 53%. Why? representation. 

Different demographics is the reason for the more diverse fanbase.  If AEW had TV deals in other countries would look similar.  As far as I know AEW is only in English and Spanish and still lacking on TV in most international markets.

There's also the factor of free agents like Darius Carter and Shane Taylor making it public that Tony's reaction to Swole's interview has hampered their interest in signing with AEW. And if they're saying it publicly, it's not impossible to imagine that free agents like Shane Strickland, Keith Lee, Ember Moon, or Mia Yim believe the same things privately.

Jan 2, 2022 5:29:02 GMT c said:

Jan 2, 2022 2:22:37 GMT NATH45 said:

It was also reported that AEW's fanbase is 68% white, while WWE's is 53%. Why? representation. 

Different demographics is the reason for the more diverse fanbase.  If AEW had TV deals in other countries would look similar.  As far as I know AEW is only in English and Spanish and still lacking on TV in most international markets.

I should have been more thorough, it was Dynamite v RAW demographics. The flagships.

The biggest lesson again for AEW, is you don't make wild promises about being the " most inclusive " company in wrestling and promise representation and opportunities for all walks of life as part of your day 1 mission statement and just hire your mates instead. Similarly to how they were promising the women's revolution 2.0 and never delivered.

Jan 2, 2022 7:39:37 GMT NATH45 said:

Jan 2, 2022 5:29:02 GMT c said:

Different demographics is the reason for the more diverse fanbase.  If AEW had TV deals in other countries would look similar.  As far as I know AEW is only in English and Spanish and still lacking on TV in most international markets.

I should have been more thorough, it was Dynamite v RAW demographics. The flagships.

I think c's point was that Raw airs in more countries than Dynamite, so the audience is more diverse. I might be wrong though.

Jan 2, 2022 7:48:51 GMT RT said:

Jan 2, 2022 7:39:37 GMT NATH45 said:

I should have been more thorough, it was Dynamite v RAW demographics. The flagships.

I think c's point was that Raw airs in more countries than Dynamite, so the audience is more diverse. I might be wrong though.

We're talking United States.

Jan 2, 2022 2:57:51 GMT nazzer said:

Nath, if aew uses the indiea to fill ita roster. What black main eventers from the indys should they sign?

They just signed Jay Lethal who can barely if at all appear on TV for them. Carried ROH at one point, did good in TNA too.

Jan 2, 2022 1:35:29 GMT Big Pete said:

What it all boils down to is the lack of opportunity for the wrestlers to break out and make a name for themselves. As Swole pointed out, with all the talent in, there's a ton of talent that only gets 3 minutes to showcase themselves on Dark and that's not going going to get them over.

That's fair and I completely agree, but that's not a diversity issue.

Jan 2, 2022 2:22:37 GMT NATH45 said:

This conversation is raging on social media, obviously. And has highlighted a bigger problem with AEW. In the 3 years to the day, that AEW has existed. They have failed to develop and produce a home-grown main event talent - let alone a person of colour in that position. Their top-tier talent is bought. Whether it was The Elite and friends initially, vets like Sting, Punk & Jericho, WWE drop-offs like Danielson, Mox & Adam Cole, etc. And guess what, they're all Caucasian. 

MJF, Darby Allin, Britt Baker are all home grown top talent. Could easily see Jungle Boy and Wardlow getting there in a couple of year's time as well.

Jan 2, 2022 11:38:13 GMT Emperor said:

Jan 2, 2022 1:35:29 GMT Big Pete said:

What it all boils down to is the lack of opportunity for the wrestlers to break out and make a name for themselves. As Swole pointed out, with all the talent in, there's a ton of talent that only gets 3 minutes to showcase themselves on Dark and that's not going going to get them over.

That's fair and I completely agree, but that's not a diversity issue.

It was one of the issues she raised in the interview and it speaks to the heart of the matter. If the program was formatted better and they gave their talent more opportunity then you'd have less disgruntled employees.

Of course there is always going to be minority groups who want better representation in their media. Unless Khan did something drastic, he wouldn't be able to please everyone in the African American community and there are limitations to the company. AEW after all was an extension of a YouTube behind the scenes/skit show created be a couple of west coast christian dudes and their work colleagues. That's what drew the 10,000 to the Sears Centre and that's what's selling out arenas to this day. However moving forward if they want sustainability and they want to expand their market profile they're going to have to try and cater to these concerns and give everyone a fair chance of success.

Jan 2, 2022 11:38:13 GMT Emperor said:

Jan 2, 2022 1:35:29 GMT Big Pete said:

What it all boils down to is the lack of opportunity for the wrestlers to break out and make a name for themselves. As Swole pointed out, with all the talent in, there's a ton of talent that only gets 3 minutes to showcase themselves on Dark and that's not going going to get them over.

That's fair and I completely agree, but that's not a diversity issue.

Jan 2, 2022 2:22:37 GMT NATH45 said:

This conversation is raging on social media, obviously. And has highlighted a bigger problem with AEW. In the 3 years to the day, that AEW has existed. They have failed to develop and produce a home-grown main event talent - let alone a person of colour in that position. Their top-tier talent is bought. Whether it was The Elite and friends initially, vets like Sting, Punk & Jericho, WWE drop-offs like Danielson, Mox & Adam Cole, etc. And guess what, they're all Caucasian. 

MJF, Darby Allin, Britt Baker are all home grown top talent. Could easily see Jungle Boy and Wardlow getting there in a couple of year's time as well.

Not Main Event talent.

None of those names have cracked that ceiling yet and firmly been established as top tier, main eventers.

The real pillars. The guys keeping the lights on... The top guys in AEW are Omega, Moxley, Punk, Jericho and Danielson.

What really is confusing me about all of this is Jade Cargill is undefeated and likely taking a belt Weds. Feels a whole lot like Swole thought this should be her spot and is raging.

A lot of people speaking out in support of Tony on twitter. Hobbs said he got a lot of great opportunities and Shida and others said the same.

Find it weird that Tay Conti is not considered by most to be a diverse star either because she is white, despite being Brazilian. Ditto for Miro being white despite being Bulgarian.

Jan 2, 2022 13:06:56 GMT NATH45 said:

Jan 2, 2022 11:38:13 GMT Emperor said:

That's fair and I completely agree, but that's not a diversity issue.

MJF, Darby Allin, Britt Baker are all home grown top talent. Could easily see Jungle Boy and Wardlow getting there in a couple of year's time as well.

Not Main Event talent.

None of those names have cracked that ceiling yet and firmly been established as top tier, main eventers.

The real pillars. The guys keeping the lights on... The top guys in AEW are Omega, Moxley, Punk, Jericho and Danielson.

I would say that even Punk is not really main event talent anymore.  He is an attraction now like Sting.  Hangman def is in that group and getting a lot of fan response these days.

Meltzer chimed in with a real hot take. Basically went with that you need to focus on draws, and if you push someone who does not draw just because they are diverse it will hurt ratings. Taken to the extreme, if you keep pushing diverse talent who is no over, then the company will fail entire and no one gets any chances.

If I wanted a take on diversity, I’d go to about five million different people before I went to dinosaur Dave.

He does have a point that if a fed cannot get ratings, no one gets any exposure. Can run an all black fed, but if no one is watching, then it becomes meaningless in regards to representation.

Jan 2, 2022 2:57:51 GMT nazzer said:

Nath, if aew uses the indiea to fill ita roster. What black main eventers from the indys should they sign?

Mysterious Q

Jan 2, 2022 15:41:51 GMT c said:

He does have a point that if a fed cannot get ratings, no one gets any exposure. Can run an all black fed, but if no one is watching, then it becomes meaningless in regards to representation.

He’s also a fucking pig so fuck his point.

Jan 2, 2022 15:41:51 GMT c said:

He does have a point that if a fed cannot get ratings, no one gets any exposure. Can run an all black fed, but if no one is watching, then it becomes meaningless in regards to representation.

Representation isn't about replacing the entire product with black wrestlers, or people of colour.

I thought if anyone understood that, it was you.

So, you use your top guys to bring in viewership ( Omega, Mox, Danielson, etc ) then utilise the mid-card to establish new acts. Including POC. Take someone like Andrade for example.. rather than use him as kindling in another Cody dumpster fire, he should be booked well, and featured as a star. As the long-term pay-off is, he potentially becomes a top guy and being Latino, he attracts an entirely new demographic to the product. And you can't argue, Andrade isn't a good performer either.

That is not what they are asking for though. They want the top people to be POC for representation reasons. Also for some reason latinos are not included as Sammy was champ and Lucha Bros are champs and both headlines showed recently. Or headlining and holding a title is not considered being a top talent. Hard to say with the arguments that are made.

Also have a feeling Swole will not make it to the main roster of WWE and quit wrestling over it claiming the whole industry is too racist for her.  I just do not see WWE pushing her is there is any chance she will not be reliable.  Which is really why she failed in AEW.  You do not want to push someone with issues that means they will miss advertised shows.

They built Adam Page and Britt Baker from the ground up. They made Daniel Garcia seem like a star in literally two weeks because they positioned him against Moxley and Darby and CM PUNK. You can literally make anyone seem important by trying to position them as such. There's literally nothing stopping Tony Khan from doing that for Lee Moriarty or Red Velvet or Lee Johnson or literally anyone. You can get anyone over, you just have to push them. Otherwise it creates a self-fulfilling prophecy where certain people don't get pushed because they're not over, and they're not over because they don't get pushed.

They pushed Swole and she did not get over...

Jan 2, 2022 22:23:54 GMT c said:

They pushed Swole and she did not get over...

They pushed QT Marshall and he got change the channel heat yet he still can get TV time whenever his faction gets called upon. 

QT Marshall still matters in AEW booking too. 

Wasn't one of Swole's problems that there was no writing team and only one booker?

Lio on the take now.

/photo/1

Jan 2, 2022 22:23:54 GMT c said:

They pushed Swole and she did not get over...

They push Cody and everyone hates him, so...

Choices are made.

Probably the worst recommendation ever. If anyone chooses Cody over you, you know you suck. Nobody likes Cody. Nobody has ever trusted or respected anyone named Cody. Raven knows what I'm talking about.

Jan 3, 2022 0:51:27 GMT NATH45 said:

Jan 2, 2022 22:23:54 GMT c said:

They pushed Swole and she did not get over...

They push Cody and everyone hates him, so...

Choices are made.

So Cody and Swole were equals in AEW?

Jan 3, 2022 0:55:53 GMT @ness said:

Probably the worst recommendation ever. If anyone chooses Cody over you, you know you suck. Nobody likes Cody. Nobody has ever trusted or respected anyone named Cody. Raven knows what I'm talking about.

Woah. I guess you & Raven have heat?

Look, let's just take a step back for a second. Whether or not you think Swole is a good wrestler is irrelevant. The validity of someone's perspective and their lived experiences should not live and die based on how good their goddamn "workrate" is.

Jan 3, 2022 3:08:43 GMT KITN said:

Look, let's just take a step back for a second. Whether or not you think Swole is a good wrestler is irrelevant. The validity of someone's perspective and their lived experiences should not live and die based on how good their goddamn "workrate" is.

Especially when your company employs Marko Stunt or Dr. Luther who can barely walk to the ring. :lol: