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Post by thereallt on Feb 17, 2018 18:12:05 GMT
Raging Bull was #3 on my list. It is an absolute master class of cinema that has withstood the test of time and has influenced so many other films. Hell the final shot of Boogie Nights was pretty much taken frame from frame from this movie.
Ordinary People very much lives up to it's name compared to Raging Bull. Easily one of the top 3 Oscar robberies ever.
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Post by CM Punk'd on Feb 17, 2018 18:56:34 GMT
I agree that it was incredible filming. Every one of LaMotta's fights were filmed in a different style, and it was breathtaking. Especially the one fight where Jake was suppose to throw the fight. When it began, and Jake was following to script, the camera was outside of the ring, as he was getting beaten. But when Jake decided to break script, and start fighting back and winning, that one camera effortlessly and fluently went from outside, to inside the ring in a single shot.
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Post by Shootist on Feb 17, 2018 19:15:53 GMT
Raging Bull was my number 1, technically one of the finest films ever made and Scorsese at the peak of his powers. Donald Sutherland had a fantastic performance in Ordinary People but the movie itself is very bland compared to Raging Bull. Elephant Man also just missed my top ten for another 1980 snub.
At least Thelma Schoonmaker, Scorsese's faithful editor got some recognition. Just a perfect example of how to craft a movie.
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Post by UT on Feb 17, 2018 20:36:41 GMT
Ray Dr. Strangelove The Red Shoes
12 Angry Men Citizen Kane LA Confidential Jerry Maguire Apollo 13 The Pianist The Color Purple
ET Toy Story 3 Mad Max: Fury Road Mystic River
Munich Sideways Descendants As Good As It Gets District 9
The Hustler Inception Up All The Presidents Men
Elephant Man There Will Be Blood Born on the Fourth of July 2001: A Space Odyssey On Golden Pond The Killing Fields
Network It's a Wonderful Life Who's Afraid of Virginia Wolfe Moneyball The Revenant Silver Linings Playbook
The Miracle on 34th Street The Martian The Right Stuff
Tootsie Jaws Erin Brokovich Inglorious Bastards Scent of a Woman
American Sniper A Few Good Men LOTR: Fellowship of the Ring LOTR: The Two Towers
This is about the bottom 2/3 of the misses list , the closers calls I will poster after the countdown. There were so many this time around though I felt I should post some early.
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Post by UT on Feb 17, 2018 20:44:01 GMT
On there from my list:
Jerry Maguire - I already said this was on my list , and I think it should of won that year. Charming as can be Tom Cruise , Cuba Gooding at the height of his abilities and Renee Zellweger being the perfect foil and love interest of Cruise. And obviously the little it has to do with football is going to elevate it for me.
ET - I just find that this holds up a bunch for a kids movie , and is one of the best children movies ever made. Ghandi is something I remember seeing on cable as a child at an Aunt and Uncle house - I was obviously not the right age to enjoy it but I'll never not be the right age for ET.
Moneyball - I'm not even a baseball guy , not a huge numbers guys when it comes to advanced stuff in sports but I heard good things about Moneyball and gave it a shot. Just a shockingly watchable movie , it really has no right to be this good or interesting but they really ... KNOCKED IT OUT OF THE PARK.
Silver Linings Playbook - Just didn't really enjoy Argo at all while I thought Silver Linings Playbook was the best movie I seen that year. Lawrence has never been better and Cooper was damn near perfect in the movie - it's hard to say he was snubbed by the DDL did in Lincoln but I would of given it to him anyways.
Mad Max: Fury Road - I loved this movie , the amount of work they put into the choreography and stunts of this movie , the fact they made this type of movie so emotional and engrossing was a huge accomplishment IMO. I didn't expect it to win the year it was nominated but I would of voted for it.
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Post by Shootist on Feb 17, 2018 21:29:28 GMT
I actually did try and watch How Green Was My Valley on TCM out of morbid curiosity. I was bored to tears after about 15 minutes. How Citizen Kane lost to it is still beyond me, number 2 on my list.
Maybe the biggest snub of 1995 was Mr. Holland's Opus not even being nominated. Braveheart was still a strong winner but Opus had that Forrest Gump vibe around it with nostalgia and a heart warming story. Richard Dreyfuss was aces as the fish out of water music teacher that grew to be the most respected member of the faculty by his students near the end. That tribute to him by all of his students past and present is still one of the most emotional scenes I've ever watched.
Ghandi was perfect Oscar bait for 1982 and Ben Kingsley had a strong performance in the title role. Spielberg's whimsical fantasy sap piece(in the academy's eyes) didn't stand much of a chance.
Born On The Fourth Of July is Tom Cruise's strongest performance and Stone's take on the battle at home after war should have earned him a second Oscar. Number 6 on my list, Driving Miss Daisy was definitely the safe pick. Dead Poet's Society also made my list from 1989 in the 7 spot, another inspiring film in the same vein as Mr. Holland's Opus, Robin Williams proved he could do drama as well.
2001 wasn't even nominated was it? I thought this was only for pictures nominated. Still though a snub is a snub and this was a big one.
The Martian also made my list along with the Revenant from 2015 in the 8 and 9 spots. Spotlight just doesn't seem real engaging to me even though I haven't seen it. Both the Martian and The Revenant seemed to be more in the Academy's lane but I could be wrong.
American Sniper was number 10 on my list. Clint Eastwood was on his game again and Bradley Cooper was fantastic as Chris Kyle. It's a pretty basic war movie story wise (bar the heart wrenching ending) but it had some very intense war scenes contrasted with some very real acting on the home front. Birdman seems a bit out there even for me.
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Post by UT on Feb 17, 2018 21:54:16 GMT
2001 wasn't nominated , god dammit. I didn't double check every entry .... it seemed legit though as I know it got nominated a bunch.
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Post by RT on Feb 17, 2018 23:17:02 GMT
2001 wasn't nominated , god dammit. I didn't double check every entry .... it seemed legit though as I know it got nominated a bunch. Ha, I had 2001 on my list for a long time and never bothered to check if it was actually nominated until I finished my list. Just assumed it was. I'll post my list when this is over but I'm glad I've seen no mention of Dead Poet's Society yet. I'm assuming it was one of the ones that just missed and isn't #1 or #2 though. Fully expect Goodfellas to take this but I have no idea what the other will be. I guess Star Wars? Though I have no idea why that would be a snub.
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Post by UT on Feb 17, 2018 23:23:16 GMT
2001 wasn't nominated , god dammit. I didn't double check every entry .... it seemed legit though as I know it got nominated a bunch. Ha, I had 2001 on my list for a long time and never bothered to check if it was actually nominated until I finished my list. Just assumed it was. I'll post my list when this is over but I'm glad I've seen no mention of Dead Poet's Society yet. I'm assuming it was one of the ones that just missed and isn't #1 or #2 though. Fully expect Goodfellas to take this but I have no idea what the other will be. I guess Star Wars? Though I have no idea why that would be a snub. I should have known it was you. I suspected 🤯. I'm bringing a shovel to our street fight. Mother Canucker.
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Post by RT on Feb 17, 2018 23:29:11 GMT
Ha, I had 2001 on my list for a long time and never bothered to check if it was actually nominated until I finished my list. Just assumed it was. I'll post my list when this is over but I'm glad I've seen no mention of Dead Poet's Society yet. I'm assuming it was one of the ones that just missed and isn't #1 or #2 though. Fully expect Goodfellas to take this but I have no idea what the other will be. I guess Star Wars? Though I have no idea why that would be a snub. I should have known it was you. I suspected 🤯 . I'm bringing a shovel to our street fight. Mother Canucker. Sorry I meant to say I took it off after I checked. Should have made that clear. I too blame PI.
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Post by UT on Feb 17, 2018 23:37:15 GMT
🤯 ruins everything. My apologies for the mean words I said , sir.
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Post by Emperor on Feb 18, 2018 0:07:36 GMT
All this praise makes me want to watch Raging Bull, despite it being a sports film. Not long ago I got over my irrational prejudice against Western films, and didn't regret it at all. Ditto for war films. It's time to break the sports movie curse. For some reason Raging Bull sounds more appealing than Rocky. 12 Angry Men is one of the best films ever made, so should automatically win Best Picture because it's going to be better than pretty much anything else in my eyes. I actually did try and watch How Green Was My Valley on TCM out of morbid curiosity. I was bored to tears after about 15 minutes. How Citizen Kane lost to it is still beyond me, number 2 on my list. Funny should say that, because being bored to tears after 15 minutes is exactly my experience watching Citizen Kane.
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Post by CM Punk'd on Feb 18, 2018 0:18:04 GMT
I think the biggest snub of all time, was one that didn't even make it to the final list of nominations (and thus, makes it ineligible to appear on our snubs list). And that was Spike Lee's Do The Right Thing (1989). Its exclusion from the Best Picture list enraged Roger Ebert, who had that film as his #1 best movie of that year.
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Post by UT on Feb 18, 2018 1:16:11 GMT
Emperor , I'd barely consider Raging Bull a sports movie , on the surface it's about a boxer but it's so much more than that. It's a great character piece where you watch completely self destruct through violence , arrogance and jealousy. It's nothing like Rocky , at all.
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Post by 🤯 on Feb 18, 2018 1:20:06 GMT
I don't deny that I do indeed ruin everything, but I didn't have 2001 on my list. Is that what we're talking about? 2001 wasn't nominated. Which is a super snub, sure... But this is a countdown of snubs, not super snub. Snub, snub, snub. UT UT UT UT UT UT UT UT
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Post by 🤯 on Feb 18, 2018 1:22:20 GMT
Also, just found out, Wife disagrees about 2001 being any kind of snub. Super or otherwise.
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Post by UT on Feb 18, 2018 14:48:35 GMT
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Post by UT on Feb 18, 2018 15:05:51 GMT
Goodfella's , I so regret not making this my #1 , I was wrong putting it at #2 and the only real reason I did it was because I don't think Dances With Wolves is terrible - just vastly inferior to Goodfellas. Where as I felt my #1 was robbed by a shitty movie.
Anyways... Goodfellas is an all out masterpiece of film making by Scorsese and a movie I'd take over Coppola's Godfathers ten times out of ten. Every decision Scorsese made was the right one - the choice to open the movie with the Billy Bats murder at the beginning to set the tone for the audience for the rest of the movie and showing the audience what they are in for was brilliant. It's little things like that I enjoy discovering about film making and the nuances of things that subconsciously reaches the audience.
The tracking shot with Henry and Karen was another thing of brilliance , one of the best shot scenes in the history of cinema IMO - just because of the degree of difficulty and how important to that moment of the movie it was.
The ending of the movie when everything goes to hell and they spend exactly the same amount of time with the guns , and the brother , and the gravy to show you that although some seems trivial , Henry Hill was so fucking out of it that all these things registered just as important as the other. Brilliant.
I want to completely go into this movie scene by scene but I don't have that kind of time - I will just say the way that Scorsese spent the first half of the movie building up how amazing the gangster lifestyle is , making you love these charming guys even know you know at your core they weren't good people. He showed up the highs of highs , even through Karen's eyes , who becomes almost a surrogate through the audience. You fall head over heels for this lifestyle and you love it , you accept it because it's beautiful and flashy and a part of you wants to experience it.
Then the movie takes a incredible turn where Scorsese spends the next 75 minutes completely tearing down everything he built up for you in the first part of the movie. He's showing you the pitfalls and completely deconstructing the very myths he already helped build and you as the audience feel almost uncomfortable for the second half of this ride. Those guys you found charming and likable are now proving to you that they cannot be trusted , they should not be liked and you really start feeling disgust towards your favorite character. It's really just brilliant filmmaking and the first movie I ever asked why I love it so much and investigated why - the work Scorsese put into this movie and the brilliance of tearing down everything you built is incredible.
Imagine a world class architect walking you through a building and showing you all the brilliant designs and every beautiful thing about his home , and then turning around half way through and showing you how the home is falling apart and those beautiful things covering up major problems with the house.
So yeah , influential as any movie on this countdown. We damn sure wouldn't have gotten The Soprano's if not for Goodfellas and so many of the mob movies to come after it wouldn't be the same. I don't see how this isn't the biggest snub of all time , Dances With Wolves is a fine film but it didn't mean nearly as much to the movie and television world as Goodfellas continues to mean.
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Post by thereallt on Feb 18, 2018 16:59:46 GMT
Goodfellas was also #2 on my list. Dances with Wolves was a complete and utter snooze fest compared to the brilliance that is Goodfellas. I agree completely with everything UT posted about it and IMO it is the single greatest gangster movie of all-time. For Scorsese's films only Raging Bull gives it any serious competition.
The only reason this isn't biggest Oscar snub of all-time is because my #1 was an even worse snub, as it was beaten by a much shittier movie than Dance with Wolves.
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Post by mikec on Feb 18, 2018 19:29:55 GMT
Dances with Wolves is the drizzling shits. Goodfellas is an American classic. I expected Goodfellas to be number one and it has a great argument for it.
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Post by Shootist on Feb 18, 2018 19:44:23 GMT
I actually liked Dances With Wolves and at the time it was a much better fit for best picture. Time has been very kind to Goodfellas and rightfully so and seems the obvious winner now, it still stands as one of my top 5 films of all time. Dances though was the right picture at the right time while Goodfellas was a bit too "in you face". Had it come out a decade or so later it could have easily won a best picture award. It still deserved much more than 1 award though as Thelma Schoonmaker's magic is all over Goodfellas with her break neck editing style.
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Post by RagnarokMike on Feb 19, 2018 1:32:28 GMT
I don't hate Dances with Wolves, it's an okay movie, completely unspectacular. Goodfellas, on the other hand, is maybe the best movie by a man who's churned down no shortage of great films. Second in the genre only to the Godfather, classic start to finish.
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Post by UT on Feb 19, 2018 14:02:57 GMT
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Post by UT on Feb 19, 2018 14:10:22 GMT
Not a real shocker for #1 , but probably the right choice as Saving Private Ryan is generally considered to be the worst snub of all time , I had it like #5 on my list but really have no problems with it taking first place. This entire loss came down to Miramax being a marketing juggernaut because in no way , shape or form was it the better movie then and it definitely isn't now. Shakespeare in Love isn't remembered for what it did on screen nearly as much as it is for robbing SVP. I think that winning the Oscar then backfired in the longrun.
Anyways I want to thank everyone again who submitted a list and came along in the discussion. This might be my favorite list we've done yet and judging by the replies - it's the most successful as well. A few fun things
- Saving Private Ryan was the largest margin of "victory" by a first place movie ever in these countdowns. - And that is even including the fact that Goodfellas was the highest scoring second place movie of all time. I'll have the near misses up shortly. Thank yall again!
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Post by UT on Feb 19, 2018 14:26:38 GMT
The Green Mile Dead Poets Society
Good Will Hunting
Star Wars
Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid
Brokeback Mountain The Wizard of Oz Django Unchained
Taxi Driver
Green Mile was actually my #1 and I thought it was going to end up making yet another list here at PW , in hindsight it should of been my #2 behind Goodfellas and more of my vote was directed at how much I hate American Beauty. Even before Spacey proved to be a pile of shit I thought that movie was complete trash and Green Mile was better in every imaginable way.
Brokeback Mountain - I said it made #10 on my list out of the lack of respect I have for Crash , if I had seen Raging Bull sooner it would of been bumped but I was shocked to see it didn't make the overall top ten.
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Post by Big Pete on Feb 19, 2018 14:45:42 GMT
1. Raiders of the Lost Ark 2. The Pianist 3. Saving Private Ryan 4. Fargo 5. Dead Poets Society 6. The Elephant Man 7. Goodfellas 8. The Right Stuff 9. Brokeback Mountain 10. The Colour Purple
Raiders is one of the most influential movies of all-time and lost to a BBC-esque production with one good song.
The Pianist is a beautiful movie, one of the best of it's decade and lost out to an 'extravagant' musical. I could understand it if Polanski was blacklisted, but they gave the guy an Oscar for Best Picture and Brody an Oscar for performance, so what the hell?
The only reason I didn't having Saving Private Ryan higher is that I haven't seen Shakespeare In Love to judge it and don't think I ever will. One of the greatest war movies of all-time and some of the toughest scenes put to film.
A bit of favoritism here, but Fargo was a far more interesting movie and felt more of it's time than the English Patient which was a bore. Have come to learn there are people out there who will actually defend the English Patient, I suppose they watched it before the Seinfeld episode.
Driving Miss Daisy maybe the most bizarre choice I've ever seen for Best Picture. It's an OK movie but feels like it's from another era and for a much older audience than the norm. There are better movies that were looked over, but I felt the gulf here was bigger.
Most people would say Raging Bull, but the Elephant Man is every bit as good and deserves more recognition. The only reason it isn't higher is because Ordinary People could be good for all I know, I literally hadn't heard of it until I put the list together.
The Goodfellas is my favourite movie on the list, but I enjoyed Dances With Wolves more than I thought I would. Maybe it's because I've got a weird tolerance for Costner? It didn't deserve Best Picture, but it isn't completely out of left field like others.
The Right Stuff is a damn good movie that nobody talks about. Granted, it doesn't have the co-producer of The Simpsons, Jack, Lithgow or Jeff Daniels but it's got a fine cast in it's own right, Bill Conti scoring the movie and a more gripping plot. It doesn't hurt that Terms is more of a chick flick either. I had a feeling that it would fly under the radar, so I wanted to get it's name out there again.
If I put more effort into my list and had enough time to watch all the best picture nominees, who knows how high Brokeback would be. I personally enjoyed the other movies more, but this was a great comeback from Ang Lee and a timely movie. Our discussion around homosexuality was beginning to shift around this time with more and more tolerance being shown and I think this movie really helped the community in it's own way. Great performances and it's the type of movie I think Call Me By Your Name wishes it was.
Out of Africa bored me to tears, meanwhile The Colour Purple was a huge film that's remembered to this day. Between this, Indiana Jones and ET, it's no wonder people thought Spielberg was overdue in 93.
Honorable Mentions: Citizen Kane (1941), Taxi Driver (1977), Room (2015).
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Post by thereallt on Feb 19, 2018 15:43:31 GMT
I couidn't pick any other #1 other than Saving Private Ryan. It was utterly laughable Shakespeare in Love beat it out and it's very telling that Shakespeare in Love is barely remembered now. By contrast Saving Private is an absolutely landmark film that is still considered the gold standard for war drama 20 years later.
1.Saving Private Ryan 2.Goodfellas 3.Raging Bull 4.Raiders of the Lost Ark 5.Star Wars(1977) 6.The Killing Fields 7.Dead Poets Society 8.Shawshank Redemption 9.Pulp Fiction 10.Lord of the Rings :Two Towers.
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Post by CM Punk'd on Feb 19, 2018 15:48:17 GMT
1. Raging Bull 2. Goodfellas 3. The Color Purple 4. Pulp Fiction 5. Taxi Driver 6. On Golden Pond 7. Network 8. Fargo 9. The Shawshank Redemption 10. Saving Private Ryan
I only had Saving Private Ryan at #10 because it was added at the very last second, and I didn't have time to revise the list. And I thought it would be a shame to leave it off my list.
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Post by Emperor on Feb 19, 2018 15:56:53 GMT
1. Good Will Hunting 2. 12 Angry Men 3. Butch Cassidy and The Sundance Kid 4. The Shawshank Redemption 5. The Hustler 6. The Social Network 7. Saving Private Ryan 8. Miracle on 34th Street 9. The Green Mile 10. Silver Linings Playbook
Didn't expect Good Will Hunting to score highly considering it's against the juggernaut that is Titanic. However, Good Will Hunting is a near flawless masterpiece in my opinion, and is one of my lifetime Best Pictures. Would likely have been my #1 regardless of which year it was released or what film won over it.
Similar reasoning for 12 Angry Men and Butch Cassidy. In the latter case, I've actually seen Midnight Cowboy and didn't like it all. Tremendously boring. One of the few snubs on my list in which I have seen the Best Picture winner.
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Post by Shootist on Feb 19, 2018 19:07:13 GMT
1. Raging Bull 2. Citizen Kane 3. Saving Private Ryan 4. Fargo 5. The Green Mile 6. Born On The Fourth Of July 7. Dead Poet's Society 8. The Martian 9. The Revenant 10. American Sniper
I'm fine with Saving Private Ryan as well for number 1, I just felt the gap between the 1980 and 1941 winners and nominees were much greater.
Nice shout out for the Right Stuff btw, I've always been fascinated with aviation and space travel in general and that along with the HBO miniseries From The Earth To The Moon are the standard bearers for the genre. Good to see Apollo 13 make some lists too.
Chuck Yeager just turned 95 this week while the man who played him in The Right Stuff, Sam Shepard, is no longer with us, weird.
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