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Post by Big Pete on Aug 10, 2019 17:15:17 GMT
Now wait just a god damn second.
When somebody says they're the Marty Jannetty of the tag team, they're not saying they're a coked up fruit loop who can't get their lives straight. As far as I'm concerned, it's just the beta tag team member, the guy who came out of the tag team a lesser star. I've got nothing against the CLB, but he was no where near the Rated R Superstar and by my count he was the Jannetty in not one but two tag teams, I'm talking of course about the illustrious Vitamin C.
And easily he was the best Jannetty because unlike the namesake, you don't feel sad for him. Christian made the Jannetty tag work for him, even riding it to his maiden championship win which he got by avenging Edge. Then it double backed on him because Edge refused to help him when Christian thought he'd be his ace up his sleeve against Orton at SummerSlam 2011.
And just like Jannetty, Christian was an excellent hand who never got his due. I'll swear by Christian-Jericho at Wrestlemania XX being one of the greatest Mania matches of all-time. I'll swear by Christian-Swagger being one of the greatest ECW matches (sorry Shin) of all-time. And the Operatic Christian theme still slaps.
Don't feed me some hipster line that it should have been Gangrel. Gangrel is the Al Green of tag team wrestlers, nobody gives a fuck.
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Post by Big Pete on Aug 10, 2019 17:27:09 GMT
Jim Cornette killed Charlie Haas for me. After Shelton left, Charlie became the Hardcore Holly of ROH and he just became miserable to watch. Maybe his work holds up better than I remember, but it was at this point I realised that ROH was simply not worth my time and I made the jump to NJPW.
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Post by Ness on Aug 10, 2019 17:53:23 GMT
Can't lie, that forced roh push was as much as I've enjoyed him minus the impressions. Bizarro world greatness.
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Post by kingoftheworld on Aug 10, 2019 17:55:10 GMT
I’m with PI, Shelton can hardly be considered that much as Shawn Michaels that you can call Haas the Jannetty.
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Post by thereallt on Aug 10, 2019 21:29:05 GMT
Hey!!! What's wrong with Al Green? :@
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Post by Baker on Aug 10, 2019 23:12:21 GMT
I had Charlie Haas at #6. Like Mercury, Haas was born to be a Jannetty.
I get where you guys are coming from with Benjamin not becoming a big enough star for WGTT to have a true Michaels/Jannetty dynamic. On the other hand, come on! Haas was clearly the lesser member of WGTT from day one.
I never enjoyed him in any role other than the Jannetty of WGTT. I guess the impersonations gimmick is his non-WGTT highlight? That run did nothing for me. The gimmick had already been done to death by that point.
Love the Haas of Pain though. What a badass submission finisher that was. Definitely one of my favorite moves in wrestling at the time.
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Post by Strobe on Aug 11, 2019 11:25:07 GMT
Hey!!! What's wrong with Al Green? Yeah, Big Pete got some explaining to do. I can see how Christian both does and doesn't deserve to be on a list like this. I could argue that if he is to be on it, that he should probably be #1, as he may be the most accomplished wrestler who will perennially be mainly remembered for his tag team, in which he was the second guy (whether you preferred Christian, Edge was always treated as the star).
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Post by Big Pete on Aug 11, 2019 13:07:59 GMT
Don't tell me you're all Brian Adams fans as well? Can't say I blame ya'll for sleeping on Al Green, aka Blade of the Master Blasters. How is Screamin' Norman supposed to get to work now? I can't wait to see him pop up in Bake's 200 favourite wrestlers.
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Post by 🤯 on Aug 11, 2019 13:46:22 GMT
I had Charlie Haas at #6. Like Mercury, Haas was born to be a Jannetty. I get where you guys are coming from with Benjamin not becoming a big enough star for WGTT to have a true Michaels/Jannetty dynamic. On the other hand, come on! Haas was clearly the lesser member of WGTT from day one. I never enjoyed him in any role other than the Jannetty of WGTT. I guess the impersonations gimmick is his non-WGTT highlight? That run did nothing for me. The gimmick had already been done to death by that point. Love the Haas of Pain though. What a badass submission finisher that was. Definitely one of my favorite moves in wrestling at the time. I *loved* the Haas of Pain, so much so that it caused me to hold Charlie in equal reverence as Shelton in the Team Angle days. But good point about Charlie literally being born to play #2. I think he played second fiddle to brother Russ, whom I vaguely recall getting way more of the mag hype back in the day (although not sure if that was before or after his untimely passing). Also, shout-out to Big Pete for highlighting Christian's Goat contender entrance music.
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Post by Strobe on Aug 11, 2019 14:08:05 GMT
I was so confused by the analogy. I was all "Al Green wasn't even in a duo!" Don't tell me you're all Brian Adams fans as well? Beautiful line. Flawless victory.
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Post by UT on Aug 11, 2019 14:26:21 GMT
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Post by UT on Aug 11, 2019 14:29:50 GMT
Bart was an interesting one , I had to throw him on the end of my list for that epic run in the Brawl for All where he upset pretty much everyone as a bit of a badass. It's sad that his biggest claim to fame was winning the Brawl for All for about 20 seconds and instantly became the dude foolishly knocked out by Butterbean.
Billy on the other hand was clearly the one the WWE wanted to push and tried and tried again. I wonder which is worse for these Marty's - their former partner going on to singles dominance or in THIS case - going on to arguably be the greatest WWE tag team ever. Or at least in the conversation. It has to sting more with what Billy and Road Dogg ended up doing as the Outlaws.
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Post by Big Pete on Aug 11, 2019 16:40:58 GMT
The only reason it came to mind is because I recently watched an old Nitro match where Goldberg defended the title against Al with Nash was on commentary. It was so bizarre to have Goldberg working the likes of Green, Putski and Fuller around that time, it was like they had it pencilled in months in advance and never got around to changing it.
I always wondered what happened to him. Wrestlemania XV was the first ever WWF show I watched in full and his name just never popped up after that. It wasn't until years later when I played through Virtua Pro Wrestling 2 on the N64 and recognised him as a gaijin alongside Johnny Ace and Vader. I'm not an AJPW expert by any means, but I presume he was also Johnny Ace's Jannetty over there?
Digging through his CageMatch profile and I never knew he had a match against Saturn in TNA. I'm going to spotlight this match.
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Post by 🤯 on Aug 11, 2019 18:06:34 GMT
Bart missed my list because of my world title win criteria.
In some slightly parallel universe, I wouldn't be surprised to see Billy win some kind of world title at some point. And in that case, Bart definitely lands somewhere on my list.
But not in this universe.
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Post by Baker on Aug 11, 2019 22:42:25 GMT
I had Bart at #4 for the very scientific reason of being the 4th Jannetty I thought of when coming up with my list. Maybe too high? It's not like he was the clear Jannetty of the Smoking Gunns when they were active. Both men were equally boring. Bart definitely fits the Jannetty bill though. Billy would go on to become 1/2 of the most over tag team in WWF history, last a long time in said company, and still have a role in wrestling 23 years after the Smoking Gunns breakup. Bart achieved none of these things. Digging through his CageMatch profile and I never knew he had a match against Saturn in TNA. I'm going to spotlight this match.
Do it! I actually remember this match. It was another one of those weirdly enjoyable random matches from early TNA. Good psychology and a style of finish I wish we had seen more of over the years. Now I want to write a little bit about Bart Gunn... He definitely would have been the Jannetty in his tag team with Johnny Ace due to Ace being a longtime company staple. They actually had a match in the early 2000s against Tenzan & Kojima that got five star/MOTY buzz in some circles. My only experience with the Bart/Ace tag team is when they showed up in WXO (aka: lousy syndicated wrestling fed with aspirations #23) as "The Movement." They cut a few promos hyping their impending debut. To further hype said debut, WXO aired clips of a match they had against Kobashi & Akiyama in All Japan. The announcers claimed it took place in the Tokyo Dome. It did not take place in the Tokyo Dome. The footage was very poor quality. It quite clearly came from a bootleg VHS tape. Meaning they did not have All Japan's permission to use it. These (seemingly random) clips aired over a two week period. Nothing says fresh and exciting wrestling show like airing admittedly taped footage from another promotion over a two week period. Worst cliffhanger in wrestling history? But the weirdest part of the story is still yet to come. For reasons known only to WXO management, the commentators gave Kobashi & Akiyama the names of old school Japanese wrestlers. One of them was definitely Mitsu Arawaka. I forget what they called the other one. The Movement never did wrestle a match for WXO.
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Post by RT on Aug 12, 2019 2:31:28 GMT
Charlie Haas was #2 on my list. That dude did literally nothing after WGTT broke up. I couldn’t believe he didn’t even get like a half decent bottom card run. He got nothing. I seriously forget he exists until people bring up WGTT and even then I’m like “oh yeah Shelton Benjamin used to be on a tag team”
Bart Gunn never crossed my mind but if he had I probably would have included him.
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Post by Big Pete on Aug 12, 2019 6:19:02 GMT
He fell into the same trap as Marc Mero.
When the WGTT was initially split up, the WWE teased they were going to do for Charlie Haas what they did for Shelton Benjamin on Raw. He was in the WWE Championship picture and was getting decent marquee matches. Then they paired him up with his wife Jackie Gayda and he found himself in an odd couples tag team with Rico and his run died from there. After that they just kept pairing him up with old Attitude Era acts until they eventually put him together with Shelton. Even then the bloom was well and truly off the rose and the only opportunity those two received was that sweet One Night Stand 2007 match against the Hardy Boyz.
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Post by UT on Aug 12, 2019 18:26:01 GMT
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Post by UT on Aug 12, 2019 18:28:30 GMT
I've never liked Matt Hardy in any version outside of his team with Jeff and Lita as Team Extreme. It was obvious all along (to me) who was the Jannetty of that tag team and he just seemed to lack much charisma and came off as trying to hard. Jeff always had an inane charisma too him and IMO left Matt in his shadow fairly early on.
I still voted for him , for the obviousness of the Jannettyitis that was deep within him and the fact he did went on to have a pretty successful singles career and some people love the Version 1.0 gimmick and the stupid fucking broken shit he was doing in TNA.
I honestly figured he'd be a little higher.
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Post by RT on Aug 12, 2019 18:31:34 GMT
Matt Hardy has me more upset than Christian. I don't even know where to begin with this.
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Post by UT on Aug 12, 2019 18:34:26 GMT
You can't argue he didn't reach nearly the heights that his brother did and unlike Christian he never even held a meaningful World Title. Yes he had some success and memorable runs but Jeff eclipsed him easily.
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Post by RT on Aug 12, 2019 18:37:51 GMT
Matt Facts/Matt Hardy V1 was pretty well-received on Smackdown's mid-card.
He left and fucked around in ROH for a bit, then returned and had a pretty good feud with Edge/Lita that was a big reason Edge got elevated as high as he did.
Then he reunited with Jeff, then left again and was awesome in TNA/ROH/indies and the eventual BROKEN Matt Hardy saga was arguably the biggest story in wrestling.
He's still getting recognition on social media even while inactive with his "You Don't Understand How Hard It Is Being Matt Hardy," videos. They're hilarious.
...
Am I the only one that understood this list? When someone gets "Jannetty'd" it's because one partner left the tag team and made it big while the other never amounted to anything and fell off the face of the Earth, only to be remembered as "that guy that was in that team with that superstar once."
Like COME ON. Not only is this crazy, HE'S IN THE TOP 5? WHAT?
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Post by RT on Aug 12, 2019 18:38:52 GMT
You can't argue he didn't reach nearly the heights that his brother did and unlike Christian he never even held a meaningful World Title. Yes he had some success and memorable runs but Jeff eclipsed him easily. You can read my other post but if the only criteria is "he didn't reach the same heights as his partner" then literally every single tag team to ever break up is eligible for this list, and that's just plain wrong.
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Post by UT on Aug 12, 2019 18:42:23 GMT
He went on to be a very successful mid carder , yes and his social media presence has seemingly always been a thing. However his biggest claim to fame inside the wrestling world is his hot girlfriend cheating on him. Hardy might be a little overqualified to go full Jannetty but when you bring up him and his brother side by side their careers aren't comparable. Jeff was a huge star while Matt was just huge. Just kidding. Had to get one more Fat Hardy joke in there.
I see your point , I do , but I don't think all scales are the the same.
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Post by RT on Aug 12, 2019 18:44:55 GMT
Disclaimer: I want to add that I was incorrect in my defence of Christian when I said I wouldn't include him in a top 25 because I just remembered I voted for him at #9, but that's only because when I did my list I couldn't think of anyone past #8 and every list I consulted didn't help me at all and I stuck him and Marty Jannetty on my list at 9 and 10 because I was out of time and literally couldn't think of anyone else. I want it to be known that I did not want to vote for either of them when doing this list but stuck them at the bottom because I had to finish my list.
If it came down to it and I had to choose I would still vote for Christian over Matt Hardy 100 times out of 100 but in an ideal world I woldn't vote for either of them and my points still stand.
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Post by RT on Aug 12, 2019 18:46:58 GMT
He went on to be a very successful mid carder , yes and his social media presence has seemingly always been a thing. However his biggest claim to fame inside the wrestling world is his hot girlfriend cheating on him. Hardy might be a little overqualified to go full Jannetty but when you bring up him and his brother side by side their careers aren't comparable. Jeff was a huge star while Matt was just huge. Just kidding. Had to get one more Fat Hardy joke in there. I see your point , I do , but I don't think all scales are the the same. his biggest claim to fame is definitely Broken Matt Hardy. I concede that given Jeff's success then a vote for Matt isn't as crazy as I initially thought, but him being in the top 10 and anywhere near the top 5 is crazy to me, given the fact that he did actually have pretty consistent singles success over the years.
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Post by Strobe on Aug 12, 2019 19:39:29 GMT
He definitely would have been the Jannetty in his tag team with Johnny Ace due to Ace being a longtime company staple. They actually had a match in the early 2000s against Tenzan & Kojima that got five star/MOTY buzz in some circles. Even crazier, it wasn't even Johnny Ace that was his partner in that match. It was Jungle Jim Steele!
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Post by kingoftheworld on Aug 12, 2019 19:44:34 GMT
The only question I have is....is Matt the Jannetty to Jeff or to Lita? :lol:
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Post by UT on Aug 12, 2019 20:01:04 GMT
You can't argue he didn't reach nearly the heights that his brother did and unlike Christian he never even held a meaningful World Title. Yes he had some success and memorable runs but Jeff eclipsed him easily. You can read my other post but if the only criteria is "he didn't reach the same heights as his partner" then literally every single tag team to ever break up is eligible for this list, and that's just plain wrong. Surely you know there is a difference between not rising to the heights of your partner , who actually reached the top of the mountain and was a bonafide star than simply just not doing as much as your Joe Schmoe partner. Jeff was a multiple time world champion , was probably the most over face in the company for a time being - those are actual heights that don't include "every team ever".
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Post by UT on Aug 12, 2019 20:02:53 GMT
He went on to be a very successful mid carder , yes and his social media presence has seemingly always been a thing. However his biggest claim to fame inside the wrestling world is his hot girlfriend cheating on him. Hardy might be a little overqualified to go full Jannetty but when you bring up him and his brother side by side their careers aren't comparable. Jeff was a huge star while Matt was just huge. Just kidding. Had to get one more Fat Hardy joke in there. I see your point , I do , but I don't think all scales are the the same. his biggest claim to fame is definitely Broken Matt Hardy. I concede that given Jeff's success then a vote for Matt isn't as crazy as I initially thought, but him being in the top 10 and anywhere near the top 5 is crazy to me, given the fact that he did actually have pretty consistent singles success over the years. Not hardly , it's the Edge and Lita love triangle. It kept Matt relevant at a time where he actually could have/should have faded into obscurity and was one of the few times where the fans actually accepted him as a face.
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