I would like to know if the difference between her testosterone levels and her peers’ testosterone levels are comparable to differences between two male athletes. How much of an advantage is it? I have sympathy for all sides in this sort of situation but particularly the woman. Using your genetics to make a career for yourself in sport is something that happens all the time in the men’s game. Nobody should be victimised for it. Interestingly, her opponent that started this furore by abandoning the fight has since apologised.

I think it’s possible the Italian athlete overreacted. Khelif has six knockouts in 51 career fights btw. For anyone wondering if she just gets in there and smashes people around with her male power, that is just plainly untrue.

Aug 2, 2024 17:56:00 GMT Todd said:

GB having a good Games so far. I assume we’re targeting 4th and beating the Aussies and Japan. Plenty of medal opportunities in the second week.

Stunned that you guys aren't in the women's soccer/football tourney, Great Britain always puts forth a really good women's side. 

Aug 2, 2024 5:15:51 GMT iron maiden said:

Nothing on this?

www.hindustantimes.com/trending/turkey-shooter-yusuf-dikec-wins-olympic-silver-hottest-meme-on-x-right-now-101722486596795-amp.html

This dude is awesome. Same with the South Korean lady who just has zero fucking emotion after nailing a world record. :laughy:

x.com/growing_daniel/status/1818189446115930491

I shitted on the shooting sport but NGL they have brought the total nonchalant attitude thus far in. These guys/gals are so routine about this, they just wake up and just get ready to shoot and exit to go back to their everyday life.  

Aug 2, 2024 17:56:32 GMT KING KID said:

ME NO NOTHING.

ME ONLY NO WHAT TRUMP TELL ME TO NO.

Quoted for truth.

A lot of people getting more upset about a cis woman hitting a cis woman than the fact that there's a convicted child rapist who pled guilty and served 4 years on the Dutch Volleyball team.

Back to the funny

www.dailydot.com/memes/turkish-olympic-shooter-meme-yusuf-dikec/

Aug 2, 2024 18:52:28 GMT iron maiden said:

A lot of people getting more upset about a cis woman hitting a cis woman than the fact that there's a convicted child rapist who pled guilty and served 4 years on the Dutch Volleyball team.

Back to the funny

www.dailydot.com/memes/turkish-olympic-shooter-meme-yusuf-dikec/

The meme comparing “I just got hired” posts was great.

Aug 2, 2024 1:41:14 GMT Blindy said:

It's a unique conversation with Khelif that is worth clarifying on, seeing a lot of chatter that she was a biologically born woman but has a DSD/Development of Sex Disorder that gives her unusual high levels of testosterone which is of course an advantage. I don't think she is transgender despite the counter argument being that Khelif has an XY chromosome and it was backed by testing. 

Again the major point is how is she still cleared and allowed to compete at the moment if she has a higher level of testosterone against other female boxers? People make a cop out argument that she can be beaten and has lost in the past but that's like me saying you can strike 1998 Mark McGwire out or 2001 Barry Bonds out because "it's been done before". Still doesn't excuse that big hurdle that people have to jump over to succeed. 

Again I don't hold the fighter accountable here, they applied to see if they can qualify and they got approved. They went through the proper protocol. Who takes the blame and is every bit deserving of the questioning are the people who clear these fighters to go and fight. Seeing the IOC double down on this decision is really baffling to me.

x.com/iocmedia/status/1819068761787244959

Either way she fights this Saturday against a Hungarian boxer in what is probably going to have a crap ton of eyeballs watching on the fallout from that. Pretty shocked this has gotten coverage on the Pat McAfee show which is an ESPN show. Logan Paul also spoke pretty loudly here and some of the female talent in WWE(Isla Dawn) pretty much are backing Khelif and saying this is a witch hunt. I didn't seriously expect this to catch fire the way it did when I found out about this yesterday but it's worthwhile conversation because everybody deserves a fair chance at their sport. Nobody wants to feel like they got cheated when they lose. 

Believed she has Swyer syndrome.  Basically she has XY genetics but develops as a female.  Has all female development and can even get pregnant and give birth.  IOC has T limits for girls that is tested as part of doping stuff, so she is likely also on t blockers to compete.   Khelif in 2022 fought and was outclassed completely by a cis girl in the world championships in Turkey.

Can see here she clearly has no power advantage.  And this was before t blockers were needed to compete.  Watching her fight, she fights for points as well, not knockouts.  And t will not help her score points, accurate punching there is all that matters.

Watch the fight can see the Italian girl did not have her head protected well, and got boinked on the nose, the most painful places to take a punch of the face.  And a spot that is not hard at all to break if you take an unprotected shot to it.

Here is the world championship fight showing that this girl is no Tyson despite what the media is claiming.  That Irish girl just dominate her entirely.  It is clear that Irish lass is throwing freaking bombs too with far more power.  And she shakes off these so called strongest women punches with ease.

Aug 2, 2024 18:06:23 GMT Todd said:

I would like to know if the difference between her testosterone levels and her peers’ testosterone levels are comparable to differences between two male athletes. How much of an advantage is it? I have sympathy for all sides in this sort of situation but particularly the woman. Using your genetics to make a career for yourself in sport is something that happens all the time in the men’s game. Nobody should be victimised for it. Interestingly, her opponent that started this furore by abandoning the fight has since apologised.

I think it’s possible the Italian athlete overreacted. Khelif has six knockouts in 51 career fights btw. For anyone wondering if she just gets in there and smashes people around with her male power, that is just plainly untrue.

The second point is very true.  Watch her fight, and she fights for points not knockouts.  She is a super lanky girl with reach that seems the Italian girl was not prepared for and got popped on the nose early.  A few of the girls that fought Khelif came to her defense claiming she has been beaten several times so clearly there is no real advantage.

Her t levels should be under 5 as that is the normal cut off used for doping.  Men normally average around 15, but can be up to 30.  When doping it can go even higher.  They do not use a raw level but a ratio to test though.  Or at least used to, doping and testing evolves super fast as people find ways to dope and beat the tests.

I do not expect Khelif will win.  She is a solid boxer, but just that.  More experienced boxers can and have just outclassed her readily.  Khelif kind of boxes to win points and lacks the aggression that truly great boxers have to dominate a match and make things go their way.  People make her out to be Tyson, but she lacks that killer instinct he had, and that is why she loses to other girls that have it so easily.

x.com/Algeria_FC/status/1819387003546288411

Ouch, people can really suck, the Hungarian boxer reposted 2-3 pretty insulting pictures/words towards Khelif. I think Hungary has already filed to protest this upcoming fight but the Hungarian boxer will still try and fight. That's a terrible look to post stuff like that on Instagram though about someone.

I’ll admit this.

If she is indeed a biological woman, then she deserves no blame for any of this and I’m embarrassed to have attacked her. I can only imagine how hard this has been on her so far and she’s probably being shielded from the more vicious stuff.

Carini came out to support Khelif now even and apologized for not shaking her hand. Seems a whole lot of people went to arms for something that was merely being manipulated to inspire rage.

apnews.com/article/angela-carini-imane-khelif-boxing-63e9dbaa30f1e29196d4162c72c2babf

Aug 2, 2024 21:11:51 GMT KING KID said:

I’ll admit this.

If she is indeed a biological woman, then she deserves no blame for any of this and I’m embarrassed to have attacked her. I can only imagine how hard this has been on her so far and she’s probably being shielded from the more vicious stuff.

She’s, to an extent, both.

We need to stop pretending T Levels are the only thing that separate male and female development when it comes to athletics.

Testosterone isn’t the only reason men (generally and at the highest levels) run, swim, hit, throw, lift, etc harder, faster, further and more.

Aug 2, 2024 22:55:40 GMT KJ said:

Aug 2, 2024 21:11:51 GMT KING KID said:

I’ll admit this.

If she is indeed a biological woman, then she deserves no blame for any of this and I’m embarrassed to have attacked her. I can only imagine how hard this has been on her so far and she’s probably being shielded from the more vicious stuff.

She’s, to an extent, both.

We need to stop pretending T Levels are the only thing that separate male and female development when it comes to athletics.

Testosterone isn’t the only reason men (generally and at the highest levels) run, swim, hit, throw, lift, etc harder, faster, further and more.

I mean, genetically though there’s a significant difference between Michael Phelps and myself. We don’t pretend that only hard work and good coaching made him the most decorated US Olympian and me a guy that posts on a wrestling message board.

And hormone production is the biggest significant known reason men do those things better. Per the American College of Sports Medicine www.acsm.org/news-detail/2023/09/29/acsm-releases-expert-consensus-statement-the-biological-basis-of-sex-differences-in-athletic-performance

Biological sex is a determinant of athletic performance: adult males are faster, stronger, more powerful than females because of fundamental sex differences in anatomy and physiology dictated by sex chromosomes.

Before puberty, sex differences in athletic performance are minimal. Significant differences emerge at puberty (-12 years) due to anabolic effects of testosterone in males. Testosterone levels rise 20-30-fold in males during puberty and are 15 times higher in males than females by age 18.

Direct and indirect effects of testosterone during male puberty include increase skeletal muscle mass due to larger muscle fiber cross-sectional area, especially fast, type II fibers; lower percentage body fat; higher hemoglobin concentration and mass; larger ventricular mass (heart) and cardiac volumes; larger airways and lungs; greater body height; and longer limbs.

Now none of that means she didn’t benefit from that at some point in her life, possibly before going on birth control or some other hormone treatment to deal with any number of conditions that a woman might have wanted that treatment for.

Either way it’s more complicated than checking her genitals to decide which category she is in.

Aug 2, 2024 23:31:23 GMT mikec said:

Aug 2, 2024 22:55:40 GMT KJ said:

She’s, to an extent, both.

We need to stop pretending T Levels are the only thing that separate male and female development when it comes to athletics.

Testosterone isn’t the only reason men (generally and at the highest levels) run, swim, hit, throw, lift, etc harder, faster, further and more.

I mean, genetically though there’s a significant difference between Michael Phelps and myself. We don’t pretend that only hard work and good coaching made him the most decorated US Olympian and me a guy that posts on a wrestling message board.

And hormone production is the biggest significant known reason men do those things better. Per the American College of Sports Medicine www.acsm.org/news-detail/2023/09/29/acsm-releases-expert-consensus-statement-the-biological-basis-of-sex-differences-in-athletic-performance

Biological sex is a determinant of athletic performance: adult males are faster, stronger, more powerful than females because of fundamental sex differences in anatomy and physiology dictated by sex chromosomes.

Before puberty, sex differences in athletic performance are minimal. Significant differences emerge at puberty (-12 years) due to anabolic effects of testosterone in males. Testosterone levels rise 20-30-fold in males during puberty and are 15 times higher in males than females by age 18.

Direct and indirect effects of testosterone during male puberty include increase skeletal muscle mass due to larger muscle fiber cross-sectional area, especially fast, type II fibers; lower percentage body fat; higher hemoglobin concentration and mass; larger ventricular mass (heart) and cardiac volumes; larger airways and lungs; greater body height; and longer limbs.

Now none of that means she didn’t benefit from that at some point in her life, possibly before going on birth control or some other hormone treatment to deal with any number of conditions that a woman might have wanted that treatment for.

Either way it’s more complicated than checking her genitals to decide which category she is in.

You're right to a degree, mike. It isn't just elevated T, it's what male testosterone during puberty does - which is what she has. T is the reason; the outputs all lead to a significant disadvantage. Far more than a woman on steroids would have against her fellow female competitors.

So yeah, this really proves my point rather than the contrary. She had a massive advantage above and beyond what an XX chromosome could produce.

I don’t know about all that XYZ shit. I just thought she had a dick this whole time.

Aug 2, 2024 23:41:22 GMT KJ said:

Aug 2, 2024 23:31:23 GMT mikec said:

I mean, genetically though there’s a significant difference between Michael Phelps and myself. We don’t pretend that only hard work and good coaching made him the most decorated US Olympian and me a guy that posts on a wrestling message board.

And hormone production is the biggest significant known reason men do those things better. Per the American College of Sports Medicine www.acsm.org/news-detail/2023/09/29/acsm-releases-expert-consensus-statement-the-biological-basis-of-sex-differences-in-athletic-performance

Biological sex is a determinant of athletic performance: adult males are faster, stronger, more powerful than females because of fundamental sex differences in anatomy and physiology dictated by sex chromosomes.

Before puberty, sex differences in athletic performance are minimal. Significant differences emerge at puberty (-12 years) due to anabolic effects of testosterone in males. Testosterone levels rise 20-30-fold in males during puberty and are 15 times higher in males than females by age 18.

Direct and indirect effects of testosterone during male puberty include increase skeletal muscle mass due to larger muscle fiber cross-sectional area, especially fast, type II fibers; lower percentage body fat; higher hemoglobin concentration and mass; larger ventricular mass (heart) and cardiac volumes; larger airways and lungs; greater body height; and longer limbs.

Now none of that means she didn’t benefit from that at some point in her life, possibly before going on birth control or some other hormone treatment to deal with any number of conditions that a woman might have wanted that treatment for.

Either way it’s more complicated than checking her genitals to decide which category she is in.

You're right to a degree, mike. It isn't just elevated T, it's what male testosterone during puberty does - which is what she has. T is the reason; the outputs all lead to a significant disadvantage. Far more than a woman on steroids would have against her fellow female competitors.

So yeah, this really proves my point rather than the contrary. She had a massive advantage above and beyond what an XX chromosome could produce.

She may have (probably had?) an advantage, how much of one neither of us would know. When she started hormone therapy she would’ve significantly diminished the advantage and I don’t think that’s information we have.

Anyway that was an interesting dive into a subject I knew nothing about a week ago. Feel bad for the girl, from what has generally been said about her she had no idea this was her situation until the last year so she’s just been competing in a sport she enjoys and now is getting slandered across the world like she’s cheated her way in.

Aug 2, 2024 23:43:46 GMT KING KID said:

I don’t know about all that XYZ shit. I just thought she had a dick this whole time.

Bruh, she’s from ALGERIA. Where being gay/trans is illegal. Her ALGERIAN passport says female. You think she was born with a dick and ALGERIA allowed her to live as a girl?

The final lap of the men’s 10,000 meter was worth watching. Chaos.

Aug 3, 2024 2:12:55 GMT mikec said:

The final lap of the men’s 10,000 meter was worth watching. Chaos.

Yeah, I was somewhat confused when I watched it live.  The commentators from CBC thought that the eventual winner was just trying to avoid getting lapped.  Kinda bummed about that, because I thought initially that Mo Ahmed won the bronze, only to find out he actually finished 4th.

Still a good day for the Canadians.  A trio of bronzes on the court, in the pool, and on the trampoline.

Been avoiding this place for obvious reasons but since it’s calmed down I just have to say that Summer McIntosh rules and I hope she wins medals for the next decade.

Aug 3, 2024 0:41:21 GMT Gyro LC said:

Aug 2, 2024 23:43:46 GMT KING KID said:

I don’t know about all that XYZ shit. I just thought she had a dick this whole time.

Bruh, she’s from ALGERIA. Where being gay/trans is illegal. Her ALGERIAN passport says female. You think she was born with a dick and ALGERIA allowed her to live as a girl?

I thought she was representing Algeria but lived in France or some shit. Like team Palestine and Joel Embiid. 

Khleif won her second match and will leave with at least a bronze medal now.  Match went to time and she won 5-0 via judge score.  Hungary vows to contest the decision. 

Big win for the US Ladies. Japan impressed me with their defensive discipline and it took a crazy good shot by Trinity Rodman to seal this game. I don't know why Japan doesn't fear the US women's side but you gotta give them credit, they got out-processed for like 3/4 of the time but after going down, they really dialed it up and went out swinging. They're always insanely fun to watch. US needed this though, it's amazing what a managerial change can do @admin .  

The lone thing I would say is not using a single sub when the attack got stagnant(Horan wasn't really good today) in the 2nd half is showing too much faith in your current squad. That might be the only real criticism I can have for Hayes here. 

A lot of people have won a lot of medals over the years, brilliant athletes, but numbers getting bumped up by relays, similar distance races, etc, especially in swimming.

But gold in the same event four Games in a row is legitimately incredible from Ledecky.

The Summer of Summer continues!

A third gold for McIntosh in the pool, this time in the 200M IM.

First Canadian Olympian to win gold three times in a single games.

It's been a pretty super Saturday for the Canadians. A gold, two silvers, and a bronze today.

This is the stuff I love to see. St Lucia watching Julien Alfred win the nations first medal, gold no less.

www.tiktok.com/t/ZTNVH5whq/

Noah Lyles won the gold in the men's 100M by only 5/1000s of a second.

What a race!

Aug 4, 2024 20:00:59 GMT CM Punk'd said:

Noah Lyles won the gold in the men's 100M by only 5/1000s of a second.

What a race!

It was the power of Exodia the Forbidden One. Big Pete 

Aug 3, 2024 21:46:13 GMT CM Punk'd said:

The Summer of Summer continues!

A third gold for McIntosh in the pool, this time in the 200M IM.

First Canadian Olympian to win gold three times in a single games.

It's been a pretty super Saturday for the Canadians. A gold, two silvers, and a bronze today.

And to think if she managed to win her first race she would have 4 right now. Unbelievable showing from her. And only 17 years old. We could be seeing the beginnings of the most decorated Canadian Olympian ever.

Aug 3, 2024 16:26:29 GMT c said:

Khleif won her second match and will leave with at least a bronze medal now.  Match went to time and she won 5-0 via judge score.  Hungary vows to contest the decision. 

It's getting ugly now.


x.com/ReduxxMag/status/1820067336084238793

The other controversial female boxer, Lin Yu-Ting of Taiwan beat a Bulgarian female boxer 5-0 and the Bulgarian boxer threw an X pose showing she has XX chromosome/female vs her opponent who got DQ'd for having XY chromosome/male.